Question about Viper 11 Thwart Width (UPDATE)

Cheeks · Post by **Cheeks** » Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:26 pm

I'm adjusting outfitting this weekend on my Viper 11 and I want to take the thwarts in. Since my outfitting is custom, I can't use the outfitting guide on the site to judge how narrow my boat is (and should be)

My question is, how wide is a Viper 11 at its midpoint when outfitted for factory, and how wide is it when you take the thwarts in two inches to make it more performance based?

Just wondering, because my very unscientific method I used originally was to take the hull without thwarts and pull on them until they came in an inch or so, and I think the boat is still too wide.

Thanks in advance!

2opnboat1 · Post by **2opnboat1** » Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:36 pm

factory set up is 27 inches at center out side to out side (the tip of the H in mohawk is center). I dont recommend making the boat any narrower than 25 3/4 and 26 is even better if you go to narrow i find the boat hard to roll and it looses its playing ability.

pblanc · Post by **pblanc** » Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:37 pm

My Viper 11 with stock outfitting looks to be about 24 7/8" wide amidships, center of gunwale to center of gunwale and about 26 1/2" outside of gunwale to outside of gunwale.

2opnboat1 · Post by **2opnboat1** » Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:53 pm

Pblanc that could be our outfitting has changed thru the years the boat used to be set up very tame and in the last to years we have dailed it in.

Cheeks · Post by **Cheeks** » Wed Jun 08, 2011 7:48 pm

Thanks y'all. I'll have to check my width this weekend. The boat's been great otherwise, I just feel like I left it wider than I should have.

iRolled · Post by **iRolled** » Fri Jun 10, 2011 2:13 am

Hey Tenzing, My viper 11 is at 26 3/4" and the center. I havent yet played with the width's yet. let us know how it works out for you.

I love my viper 11. It's awesome on big water, but not as dry as my maxim.

ClassFive Boats · Post by **ClassFive Boats** » Fri Jun 10, 2011 2:53 am

remember, pulling the sides in will reduce rocker. I tried this and it can be as much as a 1 1/2 in. Lay it the floor with the thwarts removed and flex the gumwales in and out and watch the ends raise and lower..

Craig Smerda · Post by **Craig Smerda** » Fri Jun 10, 2011 3:57 am

ClassFive Boats wrote:remember, pulling the sides in will reduce rocker. I tried this and it can be as much as a 1 1/2 in. Lay it the floor with the thwarts removed and flex the gumwales in and out and watch the ends raise and lower..

no... pulling a boat in doesn't change the rocker. it does do a few other things depending on the amount of pull and way it's done.

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set ... 19522e26ea

plasticman · Post by **plasticman** » Fri Jun 10, 2011 12:25 pm

ClassFive and Craig:

Both sort of right, sort of wrong. Most hull shapes warp differently with a narrowing or widening of the "beam at gunnel" depending on whether or not the gunnels are attached.

Post by **sbroam** » Fri Jun 10, 2011 1:20 pm

Craig Smerda wrote:
ClassFive Boats wrote:remember, pulling the sides in will reduce rocker. I tried this and it can be as much as a 1 1/2 in. Lay it the floor with the thwarts removed and flex the gumwales in and out and watch the ends raise and lower..
no... pulling a boat in doesn't change the rocker. it does do a few other things depending on the amount of pull and way it's done.

Uh, maybe it depends on the boat?

http://cboats.net/cforum/viewtopic.php? ... er+thwarts

Sorry, no pictures on that. I had the thwarts attached.

Craig Smerda · Post by **Craig Smerda** » Fri Jun 10, 2011 1:53 pm

[img]https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hp ... 9835_n.jpg[/img]

you can change the flare of the sides, the depth, shear line and even the shape of the bottom and the overall length a little by pulling a canoe in at the gunnel line... but the rocker doesn't change.

the boat I tweaked in this picture grew an 1.25" in length... and the ends were lowered almost an inch from stock... but it's still the same depth as a stock boat.

how? look at the FB album
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set ... 19522e26ea

ezwater · Post by **ezwater** » Fri Jun 10, 2011 2:13 pm

Craig, over the years I've become an expert on rockers, and on two boats I owned (MR Compatriot and OT Tripper), spreading the thwarts did increase the rocker. A little simulation with a piece of paper folded over will convince one that it must be so.

I imagine that in boats with Spheretex or foam core keels, the keels may resist bending enough that the effect of spreading thwarts will be small. But when the boat bottom can bend, the ends are going to come up.

Or, were you referring to my kind of rocker?

clarion · Post by **clarion** » Fri Jun 10, 2011 2:50 pm

It not hard figure why the L'Edge would resist a rocker change when the hull is narrowed. It's made of a very thick, strong plastic and the hull forms an almost perfect arch. Way back the romans figured out that arches resist flattening. But "most" canoes will loose rocker when the sides get pulled in. And I'd bet the Viper is one of them.

Craig Smerda · Post by **Craig Smerda** » Fri Jun 10, 2011 3:32 pm

The Ocoee in this picture is pulled and adjusted... rocker is still the same. Anyone still care to try to convince me that the rocker on a Viper will change by pulling in the thwarts?

This isn't our first dance with these things...

Craig Smerda · Post by **Craig Smerda** » Fri Jun 10, 2011 3:43 pm

here's one of my old Ocoee's... pulled in and cut down... rocker was the same as stock

here's Craig Reidner's radically pulled and cut Ocoee... rocker was the same as stock