C-1 Backrest-to-rim trim/saddle measurements

[yarnellboat]

Where is your tailbone (back-of-saddle) in relation to the outside rim of the back of your cockpit?

From the thread(s) on fitting my thighs into my Score, I thought I'd transfer these measurements, in case the range is a useful starting point for others trying to place a saddle:

9.5" PyranhaSub6 (Gerry 5'5" 135lbs, 5.5" saddle)
9.5" Pyranha420 (rodeoclown 5'7" 150lbs, 6.5" saddle)
9" WS EZ (Gerry 5'5" 135lbs, 6" saddle)
9" Dagger GTX (chuck 5'9" 175lbs, 6.5" saddle)
9" WS Big EZ (Mike W. 185 lbs, 8" saddle)
8.5" WS Score (Ejner 5'7" 185lbs, 6" saddle)
8.25" WS Score (yboat 5'10" 215lbs, 7.5" saddle)
8" WS Forplay (Mike W. 185lbs, 8" saddle)
8" Jackson Super Fun (msims 240lbs)
7.5" Dagger Medieval (Bill W. 6'1" 185lbs, 7" saddle)
7" Pyranha7-0 (mshelton 6'5"! 200lbs, 6" saddle)
7" WS EZ (PaddlePower 5'10 135lbs, 6" saddle)
5.5" WS Score (sbroam 225 lbs, 9" saddle)

?? Finky (bearboater 6'2" 205lbs, 6" saddle)
?? Finky (martin 190lbs, 7.5" saddle)
?? Finky (Bruce 5'9" 155lbs, 6.5" saddle)
?? Flirt (Drew 215lbs, 6" saddle)
?? KP6.2 (Kevin 6' 155lbs, 6" saddle)
?? (billcanoes)
?? (tiggy)

Any other data? Get out your measuring tapes!

P.

[mshelton]

I think it would be beneficial to include saddle height also.

I know there is some kind of ratio / formula / physics thing-a-ma-bob that weight distribution changes depending on saddle height.

Just a thought.

[yarnellboat]

Hey, no thoughts unless you've coughed up some measurements!

I've added the ones I knew. If others add new measurements, I'll edit the initial post to keep everything in one place.

P.

[yarnellboat]

Mike (msims) wrote:

The saddle is approx 8" from the cockpit rim. Jamie Dors did it up... he basically measured the length of the boat, divide by two. I got the impression that all boats were that way!

Thanks Mike. I'm not sure why I didn't think to find the centre line of the boat the way I would do when outfitting an OC1.

The other "formula" I've heard is to have your tailbone 4-4.5" back from the centre of the kayak's 2 "hip pad" bolts.

Maybe 8" ahead of the rear rim will emerge as a common saddle placement?

P.

[Mike W.]

Fomula? Isn't that a kind of race car?
When I get a new boat I make a seat & go the the river. I paddle around w/ my seat in various places till I get what feels right. Then I get another paddler to look at it & see if it looks right. Then measure from my back to the rim. That's it. Oh, don't think that I'm questining Jamie Dors' methods. He does some awesome outfitting I wish my work looked that good.

The measurement will depend on how I want to use the boat too. In my Viper I'm real close to the back of the rim for general paddling. For races I move forward an inch, which gets the stern to the surface (longer waterline) & speeds the boat up a hair.

[billcanoes]

I think you could do a formula 4/6 or 8" back from center line, but it would be probably specific to the paddler, as the weight and build will vary the balance- for instance i have a good 30 lbs sticking out of my belly wieghting me forward, where as another fella PAC or Mike while close to the same weight as me, and just a little taller don't have to scoot there seat as far back I do.

The formula -if any- would be a good starting point for dialing the boat in

Bill

[RodeoClown]

Without any data whatsoever, I agree that it varies from boat to boat and person to person. the volume distribution, rocker profile, placement of the cockpit, etc. all factor in to it. For example, the All-Star is notorious for having the cockpit farther back than most other boats. A friend of mine who paddles for them sits with his back 10.5 inches in front of the back of the cockpit- and he's a kayaker! Most of my c-1 boats have less offset than this....

When I outfit my boats, I typically start 8-10 inches in front of the back of the cockpit and float around in the pond before glueing anything in. once I think I've got it right, everything gets glued in place, paddled a few times, adjusted, paddled, adjusted, paddled, ripped out and rebuilt, paddled, adjusted..... I think that trying to apply a formula to it is an oversimplification, and in the end, with tell you where to start your adjustments from...

having said that, i'm 5'7" 150 lbs, 6.5 in saddle w/ a 7.5 in backrest and 9.5 inches from the back of the cockpit rim in my M-L Pyranha 4-Twenty

Jeremy

[Tiggy]

The basic idea is to have the boat trimmed center? Or are you guys shooting for slightly stern trim?
I have found exactly center (weight, trim) to be good for me, allows paddler to bob either end of the boat up or down easier.
Because I havent measured anything yet, Ill make no statements! lol

[yarnellboat]

It seems to me (possibly maybe) that the smaller you are and the lower your saddle, the further forward you'll want to place your seat?

More numbers would be interesting.

I try to trim my boats level, erring just slightly to stern-heavy. This is my first C-1.

P.

[gerry]

Pat,

Add one more for a Pyranha sub 6.
Seat back 9.5 inches fwd of aft combing, seat height 5.5 inches, seat back 6 inches.
I'm 5-5, 135 lb.

I had a Wavesport EZ and I believe the back was 9 or 9.25 inches forward of the aft combing, seat height 6 inches.

Hope this helps and good luck in your outfitting.

Gerry

[bearboater]

i left the fink outfitting with the placement from the rear combing, it seems to work (3") i think. but then it is designed as a c-1, with a differently placed/shaped cockpit. the boat is fairly trim, maybe a bit stern heavy, but, i dont think i could go any farther forward without taking out massive amount of foam from the bulkhead.

i like formulas, and cars.

cheers
-isaac