Older fast boats! Pics!!!

[markzak]

I recently welcomed these two boats to my collection! The C2 looks to have originally been built with offset cockpits and have since been centered. It also has an '81 team trials sticker. The C1 looks to be slightly more recently built than 1981. Neither seem to have any other identifying tags.

If you have more info on these boats/designs/previous owners, please share:

[Smurfwarrior]

Nice boats!

[Craig Smerda]

old D/R racers Mark... really old.

the cockpits on the C2 (from the pics) don't look radically offset like some of the other old D/R C2's I've seen.

on the bright side it looks like you'll have something 'interesting' in that C1 to chase Jack Ditty with this fall on the Gauley.

looking forward to seeing how the restorations turn out...

[markzak]

I'm most excited about getting the C1 on the water. The hull is sound on that boat and its ready for the water other than the outfitting. The C2 has one area that needs work on the bottom and will need all new outfitting and bulkheads and some work to re-enforce an area towards the stern that is all crunched in. Overall though, not too much work to get these on the water after who knows how many years.

I was thinking of a light bulkhead in the C1, as I'm not confident the existing strap anchors will hold and I'm not love with the kneeling thwart as is and would have to foam it out a good bit anyway. Maybe I'll do bulkhead and straps to keep the full stress off the anchors.

Unfortunately for the handful of C1 cheat racers like J. Ditty, Alden and others, I cannot make the CheatRace this year because of work, not that I think I could compete on their level anyway. But its on like donkey kong for the New England races like the Deerfield, and the 3rd annual Non-Race on the Tohickon in the Fall. I plan on using it for attaining on the Lehigh River as often as possible too. I'll be sure to bring it down the C-boats armada in April for everyone to enjoy.

here's a better pic of the cockpit offset:

[RodeoClown]

I saw a website once that had a virtual "museum" of old boats. It took some looking to find the site, but I did eventually figure it out. Here's the C-2 (but not much info on it): http://cboats.net/c_db/list.php?type=2& ... %20WW%20C2

Anyone's guess on the C-1.

[TheKrikkitWars]

I *think* that C1 is an Ace (or possibly Ace II, certainly it has some simillarity to my Ace II) in which case you've got an excellent boat.

I do hope you'll be doing away with the thwart post-haste, though if you want the support of one, a foam block and two hinged flaps (see pic below) is a much safer compromise.



Edit: the Ace II was designed around the time of the Bala World's ('81) which fits with the idea of an early-mid 80's build date.

[Mike W.]

Josh, the hinged flaps are a great idea!

What do you call the pattern of the cloth your rim is made of? I have a project that I want to use that on & need to know what to ask for.

[Shep]

Mike, that is a Carbon/Kevlar 50/50 blend. See style 94905 on the Sweet Composites page: http://www.sweetcomposites.com/Kevlar.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Some companies offer the kevlar in blue and red too, making for some extra style in your strength.

Shep

[sbroam]

Bell made some flatwater boats in a kevlar / carbon blend they called "black gold" - mmmmmmmm.

[jennifer]

Davey here.

The C2 is a Prijon Queen Mary design, same as Ron Lugbill and I paddled in 1977 World Championships in Spittal, Austria to win the C2 Team Bronze medal for the USA, first WC medal I ever won! We built it using free Kevlar from DuPont, and also raced it in 1978 to win the Pre-Worlds at Desbiens, Quebec, the wildwater venue for the Jonquiere, Quebec Worlds. Ron and I finished 11th in it at the 1979 Worlds on the same race course.

The stripes look like what Apple Line used for boats they made around 1981. Any idea where it came from? Any labels inside the boat? It might have been used at Bala Wales Worlds in 1981. Apple Line made a lot of boats for the US Team that year.

The cockpit configuration is interesting. The spacing is quite large, making it more like an end-hole boat than a center cockpit setup. Looks like the original offset cockpits were much closer together, as was common after end-hole boats went out of fashion in '75-'76

The C1 looks like a Roock-Schmidt design, like I made one of around 1977-1978 or so, but it could also be an Ace or Ace II.

These are both fast boats!

BTW, the cockpit on the yellow C1 is made of Kevlar Carbon hybrid fabric, available here: (unashamed plug)
http://www.sweetcomposites.com/Kevlar.html#G" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[c1wwr]

C2

I used to paddle one with the seats 90cm apart. Most People used 95cm and i did see with spacing of up to 105 cm. The thing is with this boat when compared to more modern boats is the longitudonal buoyancy distribution - there is less air in the ends in the older boats. This make them less resistant top 'bobbing' when paddled and more sensitive to where the seats are positioned lengthwise. .

C1
Yes I agree that the C1 is the Roockschmidt from the end of the '70s. If I remember corectly John Butler used one at the Bala worlds. By the way Davey didn't you use an Ace II at Bourg in 86 or was it 87?

Are these good boats? Do they stand up today?
Well I think that, if set up properly the Prijon is a good boat. But it is a lot harder to set up than a modern boat.

As to the C1 I really think that the Mustang [1981] was revolutionary and the Ace II [1983] was another leap forward. the Roockschmidt was one of the best pre mustang designs but if a 'modern' paddler were to get into one he would probably think that it did not have enough air in it and that it was too wide at the cockpit.

Thanks for sharing the pictures !

[markzak]

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THE INFO!

I got the boats from Jerry McAward, who is the owner of the Northeast PA kayak school and Jim Thorpe River Adventures. I can ask him about the history more if anyone is interested. He lives in Weisport, PA on the Lehigh River.

Both boats are in excellent condition and could be paddled almost immediately. The C1 just needs outfitting and its ready to go. The C2 has one major crack on the bottom towards the stern, but its easily fixed. And yes, the C1 and C2 both seem to be made of Kevlar and are very light, so maybe 2-3 layers.

The C2 has an 81' team trial sticker. Neither boat has any identifying tags inside. I will look much closer though and report back if I see anything.

I can also measure cockpit distances or whatever anyone wants to know. I can also take more pics and different angles if that is of interest.

[cheajack]

fascinating

[Craig Smerda]

and then Davey Hearn chimed in....

best ww-Cboating site on the net there is... period.

Mark... check with Bob Rupple over at Riversport if you ever make it that way.. I seem to recall him having a few other old D/R C-boats and possibly a couple of OC's in need of some TLC if you're up to the task. Mind you... I haven't seen Bob, Kara or Erica in well over a decade but they had some cool old stuff jammed under the porch and scattered about covered in PA dirt and cob webs the last time I trekked through there.

I love history...

[Mike W.]

So the 94905 is the 'dog bone' pattern? Cool. Davey, as always, you'll get a call when it warms up & I can start my next project.