Score: saddle, trim, thighs, hip pads

[yarnellboat]

I'm 5'9" 210lbs, big thighs. I'm trying a borrowed Score...

My quads are jammed into the cockpit rim (it could be because I'd still need to trim the knee bulkhead to get right down/in). The seat is about 51/2 - 6" (and I may need higher).

The back of the seat is about 8", maybe 8 1/4", from the inside of the back of the rim. Can anyone advise if this seat placement of about 8" up sounds right?

P.

[sbroam]

Arrrggghh! I just put the boat up and I had a tape measure in my pocket! I think my pedestal is 5-6" from the cockpit rim - I'll have to check, but I think that must be close - I, too have thick legs and am *not* jammed into the cockpit rim. The saddle height is 8 almost 9 and it is very comfy and plenty stable. I'll see if I can get some pictures, too. The pictures here may help:

http://bookwoman.net/scott/outfitting.htm

The Score there is Jamie D'ors and it does not appear that his pedestal is more than about 6" forward. The pictures of my Ultra-Clean show almost the same outfitting setup that I later moved to my Score.

[yarnellboat]

Thanks Scott! If you can measure it when you get a chance, that would be great!

If I do end up with this boat, I think I'd have no choice but to cut the saddle back and raise the seat, but I don't want it trimmed stern-heavy either.

Anyone else?

Cheers, Pat.

p.s. Will a C1 skirt that fits a Cascade be of any use on the Score?

[sbroam]

Not likely on the skirt - I personally have always been able to use a standard kayak, keyhole cockpit skirt (never needed a custom skirt with the tunnel offset). I won't be able to measure anything until tonight. I'm pretty sure the seat is in the area of 5-6" forward, which is consistent with skirt usage.

[chuck naill]

Hey "Y",

My seat is 9" from the rear cockpit. I was stern squirting something awful before. I use a Perception LC-1 skirt and it is a pain to reach behind and get it on the first time of the day.

My seat height is 6.5-7.0 :

I just built another pedistal for an old fiberglass project. I used a bulk head and no thigh straps. Sometimes the straps can be a pain to adjust with the cockpit rim being next to your legs. Also consider using hip pads. I never leave home without them.

Chuck/East Tennessee/Western N.C. (Mecca of Whitewater)

[yarnellboat]

Just to be sure we're talking about the same measurement -- Chuck, is 9" from the inside of the cockpit at the centre-back as far back as you can slide your butt?

At 8" forward I can't get in, even with the lower saddle. Scott's sounds comfy: farther back & taller saddle. But I wonder why Chuck suirted and Scott doesn't?

I guess it was dream worl hoping for agreement. Chuck, what size are you?

P.

[chuck naill]

Hey "Y",

9"from the back of the cockpit. Initally, I had my a_ _ all the way back but I was being grabed and inverted by anything big. I lowered my seat and spread my knees out to get as much stability as possible. The single addition that transformed this boat was the addition of hip pads. Hip pads keep you in the boat and over your knees. Additionally, hip pads raise the sides of a craft meant to be used as a kayak.

Best Regards,

Chuck/East Tennessee

[sbroam]

I've got measurements, but my wife took the camera to a meeting ,so no pix.

I measured the cockpit rim front to back, out to out - 33"
From the outside rear rim to backrest of pedestal - 5.5"
-this is adjustable, I can move it a little back and a few inches forward
From backrest to front of pedestal - 10.5"
Height of pedestal at lowest point from hull - 9"
-the pedestal rises a little to the front
The hip pads and thigh straps are anchored in the kayak seat bolt holes - 10.5" from rear of rim
The thigh strap lower anchors are at 19" from the rear of the rim

The "adjustable" (more accurately , "snuggable") bulkhead slants forward and contacts just back from my knees, I'm not very deep into them. Between the "couch", hip pads, thigh straps, and bulkhead, I'm very secure. Yet, all of that is not tight and my thigh straps have a very nice quick release system so I can quickly get out. Since it sized for me, most folks are pretty loose.

With regards to the position of the pedestal, I've never really had a problem being back endered, but I'd rather have a boat that *was* stern heavy than one that dove too deep going downstream so it might be a bit bow light to some folks. I can stern squirt the boat very easily in flat water (from a standstill) - sinking the bow is easy, but takes a little forward speed to plow in or it can be edged and "smashed" in. I think it is a fairly well mannered boat - it is a better river runner when it's load is lighter (i.e. gear or me!)

Set up your outfitting so you can move it, at least until you figure out where you want it.

Scott

[yarnellboat]

Thanks for the measurements. Not sure what to make of the differences though. Perhaps I have some room to play with, but maybe not much.

It seems if anything will fit me, it should be something like the Score. On the other hand, I don't want to spend good money a boat that'll be stern squirting everywhere or bruising my quads.

I'll let you know how it goes once I test drive the boat I have, as best I can anyway, not really fitting into its present outfitting.

P.

[chuck naill]

Just a followup, I just got an old fiberglass C-1 for $75. I built and foam pedistal and bulkhead without straps this week. I have taken it out an played a little and the boat is staaaable. It's light of course and it has taught me to appreciate a craft that was designed to be a c-1.

I would really consider have Kaz a Millbrook build me a boat when I need one in the future. Yes, you have to be carefull, but I think these designs are what we all really want afterall.

Just a thought!!!

Chuck

[yarnellboat]

I know there are no hard-and-fast rules that account for body types and paddling styles/preferences, but...

Is it a better indicator of seat placement to measure from the seat-back forward to the centre of the kayak bolts? Say, having your saddle-back about 4-4.5" back from those bolts?

Anyone relate to that?

P.

[chuck naill]

Whatever you need to do to trim the boat will be your guide. If you are too far back, the boat is going to do things in bigger water that you will not enjoy.

Here is an example. Last week I tightened my thigh straps too tight before getting into the boat and as a result I was to far back by just a hair. Once I corrected the problem the boat started handling better. This indicates to me that I need to be down and forward at a optimum place.

Chuck

[yarnellboat]

So, I've got this Score now. And I need to fit into it. I've re-read this thread, and searched others about straps, belts and hip pads.

Problem is - my thighs are squashed against the cockpit rim, which hurts. I may trim the saddle and move myself back a bit, but I don't want to be too stearn-heavy. I'll raise the seat a bit, but don't want to be too unstable. I can also shave the insides of knee bulkhead, but that will bring my knees closer together.

Looking at Scott Broam's photos of outfitting a Score, my thighs hit up front near the screw-hole things. I tried cutting away some the top of the rim, but it's the lower combing where I jam anyway.

Another option is to heat the rim and try blowing it out a little. But I don't want to screw up the rim for the skirt. Anyone had a successful experience doing that?

The boat has "fence post" outfitting with thigh straps going to the front bolt of the 2 kayak bolts by the hips. Do people who use lap belts use these same holes? I'm not sure what kind of straps or release I'll use, I'll have to try things out.

What do people make hip pads out of? And do they also attach to one or both of these kayak bolts?

Thanks, Pat.

[yarnellboat]

Found some other threads. Seems people recommend making hip pads out of either plastic from an old boat or from plastic cutting boards?

P.

[Mike W.]

I like cutting boards as a base for the hip pads. Here are some photos of the ones in my Big EZ. Use both seat bolts. The 1st generation was 1/8" thick polyethelene. They cracked.
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/wh20crazy ... /my_photos

Here are some photos of the 1st generation (Team ETC) outfitting in the Big EZ. You may notice the duct tape at the cockpit rim on the right side. That was holding a thin piece of foam to pad my thigh. Once I added hip pads I no longer needed that foam since I stopped twisting in the boat.
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/wh20crazy ... /my_photos

Here are some photos of my Forplay outfitting:
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/wh20crazy ... /my_photos

I have lap belts in both plastic boats & my master cut Acrobat. In the wavesport boats I used the front bolt from the original kayak seat. I used weight belt & a cam strap from a dive shop. A bunch of folks seem to really like airplane seatbelts.

The seats in both the Big EZ & Forplay are 8" high. I think the Score is a little wider so stability should not be a problem. I remember Scott's Score as being very stable.
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/wh20crazy ... pg&.src=ph

If you need a skirt to fit the boat, Mountain Surf charges very little to give custom tunnel placement as well as a longer tunnel. The measurement that they need is distance from the outside edge of the back of the cockpit rim to the front of the backrest.