Wet suit vs dry suit

[rev greenbud]

So in cold weather paddling is it better to have a wet suit or a dry suit? Or dose it matter. Or do you want a wet suit under you dry suit? And if not what do you wear under your dry suit?

[Sir Adam]

Cold weather = drysuit. Layers of long underwear and fleece under it (the drysuit keeps you dry, you need the layers to stay warm). A good idea to only use layers that will keep you warm when wet in case of sweat, condensation, and leaks….

It does depend on what you mean by "cold", though, and what your personal comfort level is.

If you go dry suit go attached gore-tex socks. Not having ankle gaskets, or latex "socks" that inevitably rip is very worth it.

[Mike W.]

The problem with a wet-suit in whitewater is that it flushes. A wet suit is designed to have a layer of water between you & the suit. Your body heats that water, which keeps you warm. Roll in the river & you've just replaced that warm water w/ cold river water. Now you're cold.

For me, layers under my dry-suit vary from shorts & a rash guard, to many layers of socks, long-johns & shirts. Just depends on how cold it is that day.

[sbroam]

How old/cold are you and what is your budget? Dry suit is definitely the more comfortable and versatile (easier to change layers), but a wet suit or other similar set up (farmer john + paddling / dry top, neoprene pants + dry top) can work if you can tolerate being less than 100% dry and 100% warm 100% of the time.

[DougB]

Dry suit all the way. Wet suits are okay for cool water when the air temp is warm and good for abrasion protection on sharp rocky runs. The price of a quality dry suit can be discouraging but it's probably the best investment you can make for boating

[Larry Horne]

Might as well start out with a wet suit.
That way you will really appreciate the comfort of the drysuit when you get one.

[ezwater]

Mike W, you have climbed into a Suburban Myth about wet suit insulation.

If you get water between you and the wet suit neoprene, and that water gets to feeling warm, that does NOT indicate that it is insulating you.

Water will conduct heat outward from your skin to the wetsuit much faster than will the same thickness of air. In either case, once your heat reaches the neoprene, the insulating level depends on the thickness of the neoprene.

So that warm, wet feeling is caused by water that is heated only by your body. That heat belongs *in* your body, and more of it will stay in your body if the space under the wetsuit is filled by air.


Reverend--- I started winter paddling with a custom-fitted full wetsuit made of 3mm neoprene. The torso was tiring because it restricted rotation. I had to cut the back out of the knees so that they didn't cause ischemia in my feet. The thick neoprene restricted arm movement, so I sent the suit back to the maker to have the sleeves remade in 2mm. All that was back about 1976, when no drysuits were available.

Now, in cold weather, if I'm paddling c-1, I wear a Patagonia "shorty" that extends down to mid thigh, and goes up my torso where it can mate with a Stohlquist Goretex drytop. If I swim, water entry up the legs of the Patagonia is quite low.

If you do buy any wetsuit garment, maybe for paddling use it should be a bit looser than you would choose for SCUBA or ocean surfing. You need more play in a garment for paddling. Also, neoprene actually shrinks with age, because the nitrogen (or swamp gas) used to make all the tiny bubbles will slowly leak out. Eventually, maybe a teen or child can use it.

[Dave.E]

Here's my progression of exposure protection. Hopefully it will help you figure out what will work best for you.

My first year paddling I got about 10 days on the river and swam a bunch every time because I was terrible. 5 of those days were between 10C and 15C. Two of those days were between 5C and 10C. All I owned was a 2mm shorty wet suit, so I made it work. Layered with a long sleeve rashguard I was plenty warm in the water on the moderately cold days. I definitely wouldn't of been fine in the water for a long time though. On the very cold days I was fine until I swam, which meant a jog to the car.

I ordered a dry suit for my second year and used it a fair bit, but nothing crazy. I had the same setup every time and was completely comfortable in the water all day on moderately cold days. The very cold days were more manageable and a swim wasn't a day ruiner, but still crappy...
Body: Thick long john pants and shirt
Feet: Hiking socks>Gore-Tex Suit>7mm dive booties
Hands: 2mm neoprene gloves

This year I really wanted to get the most out of my spring so I put a lot of effort into tweaking my setup. This is what works best for me on the coldest days. I am totally fine with jumping in the water for fun, trying to balance on floating pieces of ice, making snowballs from slush floating around to throw at kayakers etc. Sometimes I need to swing my arms/feet to get blood back in them, but really all good. I was fine at -6C, in a blizzard and full on spring levels. Lots of rolling.
Body: Kokatat Polartec Suit
Feet: Hiking socks>thick wool socks>Gore-Tex Suit>Oversized NRS Work Boots
Hands: NRS Toaster Mitts

That being said, I have done a bit of diving in Ontario where the water at depth stays around 5C year round. I have always been totally fine while wearing a wetsuit. That is with over 7mm of neoprene though which is very restrictive.

Basically...
Wetsuit
- Warm enough
- Restricting
- Not versatile
- Cheaper
Drysuit
- Warmer
- Way comfier
- Doesn't restrict motion at all
- Can layer different for different weather

[hazardharry]

use the small brain to figure this one out.

[rev greenbud]

Well thanks for the advice.

[Mike W.]

ezwater, thanks for the clarification. I know that when I wore a wet-suit, I was fine till I rolled or swam in current. So that explanation didn't seem too far fetched. Either way, if you're planning on getting wet you're better off w/ a dry-suit.

[BlueFloater]

Drysuit all the way.

Compression underwear to prevent binding.
Under Armour 2.0 base layer top and bottoms
Merino wool, over-the-calf socks
Stohlquist fleece bunny suit
Stohlquist AMP Drysuit
Noeprene booties
Neoprene cap and a helmet
Neoprene gloves

Dressed this way, I am comfortable at 34 degrees swimming several times in a 4-hour period. No mobility problems.

The fleece bunny suit makes so much difference. Its moisture wicking ability is amazing.

I have Under Armour 5.0 base layer coming for really cold days.

[pblanc]

So in cold weather paddling is it better to have a wet suit or a dry suit? Or dose it matter. Or do you want a wet suit under you dry suit? And if not what do you wear under your dry suit?

As everyone has said, there is no question that for real cold weather and cold water paddling a dry suit is better than a wetsuit. But there are times when a wetsuit is good enough. Hard to say whether that would be the case for you, not knowing where and in what conditions you plan to paddle. And everyone seems to have a different degree of cold tolerance.

No sense wearing a wet suit under a dry suit, although some folks like to wear lightweight neoprene garments or Hydroskin for insulation. I prefer Capilene and/or Fleece (Polartech by Malden Mills) in multiple layers depending on conditions.

There are times I have worn a dry top with either a shorty wet suit, wet suit pants, or a "Farmer John" wetsuit underneath when paddling a decked boat. This was when I really didn't expect to come out of the boat, but accepted the possibility that I would. On the few occasions I did swim, the wet suit garment kept me "warm enough".

It is true that a wetsuit provides a good bit of paddling in the event of a swim through shallow, rocky rapids. I will sometimes wear a shorty wetsuit just for the butt paddling even in warmer conditions.

[kx250guy]

+1 on all the above. But there a few more considerations

A wet suit gives superior protection against
Bruising and cuts. Stuntmen wear them all the time. . You can walk through briars Etc without worry. No maintenance . They also float giving you practically
Another PFD strapped to you body. And they never fail.

Dry suits have superior warmth . Very cosy.
But rip a gasket or tear the suit in a swim, and you have
Zero warmth. The water collected in the suit is
Hard to get out . Your wet polypropylene cannot dry
Seeing the suit won't evaporate out . There is also a possibility Of filling up the dry suit if ripped upon
Swimming into a hole. If enough water is collected water in the suit , the extra weight will cancel the
Buoyancy effect of your PDF .
I recommend both. I use a farmer john wet suit with a
Polypropylene thermals and a gortex dry top . For decked Boating.

[arhdc]

DISCLAIMER: I don't see it but I am often referred to as a "Polar Bear" by paddling friends. My thoughts on things like cold weather gear are often discounted because of this, something that I don't get seeing as I like to be warm just like the next guy.

In the words of Craig Smerda "Buy a drysuit, it will extend your paddling season". It will keep your gear buying to a minimal and give you a full range of options for cold weather boating without buying a lot of gear that will be made obsolete when you buy a drysuit.

My general paddling gear choices are shorts and short sleeves (maybe double up on the short sleeves or wear a polar fleece tshirt) down to an air temperature of 50 deg F unless the water is snow melt cold (<40 deg F), drysuit below 50 deg F unless the sun is shining and it feels warmer. As far as gear to wear under the drysuit, I always wear wool socks because sweat filled dry-socks are uber nasty, short sleeves and shorts down to about 35 deg F air temp, one piece fleece union suit (I like the IR one without zippers) down to 15-20 deg F with neoprene gloves. Colder than 15 deg F and I just don't see most boating as being viable because things ice up too fast. Oh, and some kind of neoprene booties to protect dry-socks. With just a few pieces of gear I can boat most any day of the year in Pennsylvania and remain nice and comfortable.

Again, remember the disclaimer above, I am frequently the least dressed guy in the water but there are MANY days that I'm comfortably laughing at my overdressed sweating comrades as we paddle down the river.