Jackson Karma Unlimited

[JFC]

Has anyone converted one of these, or thought about it? I know that the Greenboat and LL Stinger have been done. It seems like the Jackson might be a little slower but might have a more primary stability, and it looks like it has more of an edge to the hull.

[ezwater]

I would look at the Zen before the Karma, unless creeking is a consideration. The Zen is said to be quite fast for its length, stable and snappy.

Pardon me, I forgot that the Karma Unlimited is a longboat. The Zen 75 is "just" a 9 footer.

[JFC]

Yeah, maybe I should have been more clear that I was asking about long boats. The Unlimited is wider and it looks like it has more of an edge than the other long boats, and that seems pretty interesting to me.

Basically, I'd like to fit out something that is fast and carves well. I'm open to other suggestions as well. I'm also 225-230 pounds, and the Dagger and LL boats seem pretty narrow to people much less heavy than me.

[ezwater]

On carving, the Stinger looks like it has a slimmer tail that might work better for faking upstream gate slalom moves.

[ClassFive Boats]

Ive been paddling a large Karma c1 for about 6 months.
Here is my experience , your results may vary:

speed-10

hole punching - 10/ best Ive ever paddled

seat position: totally critical, takes time to set it up : note : in the wrong seating position, it will not
handle properly .. by seating position i mean +/- 1/2 inch

rail into an eddy - you gotta heal it over a lot. which
is not always possible in a creek. otherwise tends to drop back a bit.

holds line in a ferry - 9

edginess- no real edge, but i somehow catch an edge out of nowhere sometimes.

plastic: soft but have had no probs. Jacksons' warranty is super.

stability : very good . to get an idea , not as stable as say a cascade , but very good,
I would not call it outstanding. Im 210 and pretty strong, and I can pull the Karma l
over with a too strong a forward stroke. I had to concentrate on keeping
my paddle very vertical.

General handling : kinda funky, and a little unpredictable at times. Its a stern c1, it does not like angled slot moves, like you'll find in the top of the Green for example . I had to lean way forward to get the bow to catch in a slot / turn. It seems to change handling traits dramatically
depending on if you lean back vs forward even when your in the best seating position. I have to stay leaned forward almost of the time , which is good for c1 anyway.

Overall I would call the Large Karma as very good, but not great C1 conversion creeker for me..

My theory of paddling is that the boat should be an extension of my will.
It goes where I want , and acts predictability, If i screw up , its because i picked a bad line, etc.
I don't even think about the boat.
I don't like having to deal with the boat and the river at the same time. For me The Karma l
falls a little into that category ... but I haven't given up on her yet.
Cheers

[johnd]

Thanks for the Karma review, Class Five, very informative. I liked the part about being an extension of the paddler. Not to be a threadjacker, but if you had any experience paddling a Prijon Pure, I would be interested. Thanks.

[ClassFive Boats]

The Pure xl was my first choice . But I couldn't
Find one anywhere. So I went with the lg Karma.
No experience in one here.

[OC1er]

Hi Jack!

I've been loving my Pure XL as a cboat. It's outlasted a new stomper and a new recon on virtually the same number of the same runs. Got Larry Horne's outfitting in it. It has oil canned over the years but still goes great.

Fast, easy to roll, gets a little sterny coming thru big holes but it always sterns out of the hole, not back in. Not edgy but it'll snap in if you lean on over. Responds great to bow strokes, an active, up-front paddling style is the way to drive this one. Great boofer.

Dan P.

[JFC]

No problem here with any tangents, for what it's worth! I'm only paddling open boats right now and I'm still very much bench racing the idea of a long boat.

[ClassFive Boats]

Update.
The plastic is softer than I thought . I hauled it in my pickup To the tellico on a warm day , just let it hangout on the tailgate . When I unloaded the boat
It had a dent on the chine from its own weight.
It was still there at the end of the day, but not as
Pronounced.