Canoe Repair

[JulieKeller.com]

I have a crack on the inside in the bottom of my Dagger Phantom. What is the best stuff to use to seal it?

Thanks,
Julie

[2opnboat1]

[sbroam]

You may want to add something to resist tension - search here for repair with keywords "raft material" and maybe "west systems G-flex". Jim Michaud has described the former - I think applied with Vynabond. Several folks other have been using the new G-flex resin (+ fiberglass cloth), not sure if they have used it inside, but seems like it would work. I think I remember somebody suggesting ABS putty plus fabric softener dryer sheets (a fiber glass cloth) - haven't tried that yet.

[yarnellboat]

Search the site for lots of info.

No smiley face required - after trying many different adhesives/epoxies (all of which proved too stiff for flexible areas around the saddle and knees), I have gone to using Shoe Goop and have no complaints!

Drill and the clean the dry cracks, fill with GOOP. It flexes, it stays, you can monitor it, and it's done the job for me better than fancier, more expensive alternatives.

PY.

[JulieKeller.com]

Thanks for the help.

[ezwater]

Phantom----- is that a Royalex boat?

[JulieKeller.com]

Yes it is a Royalex boat

[ezwater]

Of course, don't let acetone or Vynabond get down in that crack. My Royalex Synergy has hardened again where an acetone spill softened everything including the outer ABS layer.

Just putting a glue, no matter how good, on and in the crack isn't going to be good enough. You'll need something to span the crack, as you said earlier. Maybe you should drill the ends of the crack to fight further lengthening.

A vinyl raft patch would have to be applied very carefully, because if you use anything similar to Vynabond, there's that solvent and softening problem again.

If you had a piece of ABS, you could use epoxy or a flexible Urethane adhesive to apply it over the crack.

When I do the inside patch over the acetone damage on my boat, I'll use 2 or 3 concentric, bias cut Kevlar cloth patches. The new G-flex could be used, but it's thicker than West 105/205, and so does not soak the cloth as easily. But G-flex also hardens much more slowly, so there's plenty of time. I believe West suggests warming the G-flex resin a little for such cases.

As I think about it, some urethane or G-flex could go in the crack prior to the cloth application. West, and purists, would recommend dishing out or tapering the crack, but hey, we want to get done sooner and go paddling.

G-flex gets usefully hard in about a day, but I've found that it still gets stiffer and harder for at least a couple of weeks. It remains significantly tougher and more flexible than 105/205. I think G-flex may turn out to be an unusually good match for Kevlar.

[sbroam]

Goop might work. Though technically a contact cement, it is a very viscous glue that when applied thickly (preferably as several thin layers) dries into a very durable, plyable coating. We first used it to make "nose cones" on polyethyene boats (a play spot here was notorious for wearing off the right side of the nose when getting enders). Then I started using it on the outside of royalex for similar - I've got boats with Goop that has been there for 10 years +. If this is in an area that doesn't flex too much, maybe try some Goop alone - thin layers at a time though and let the solvent evaporate. You might use it to glue down some raft material, too, but I'd use it as a contact cement (apply to both surfaces and let it dry before applying).

I used Goop a long time ago, back before I was worried about solvents or bothered reading instructions, to put in some D-rings in a flatwater boat. I've never really used them and even less often stressed them. I need to give them a good going over next time I have the boat out.

I've always got a couple of tubes of Goop around!

[ezwater]

Guy who was first owner on my MR Guide used Goop or something similar for the D-rings at the thigh strap ends. One of them let go recently, with the boat just hanging upside down in the carport.

Here's my theory. I had the strap tied very tight to keep it from flopping when cartopped. I think that tension was just at the right angle that, rather than pulling straight up on the d-ring pad, it put a peeling and shear force on one edge. The pad slowly, slowly peeled loose. I have seen d-rings attached with Vynabond do this also, just peeling up at one edge when the boat is not in use.

Broam, you still need to get used to epoxy, and the new G-flex is SO much more convenient than the 2-pump 105/205 that you should not hesitate.

I thought I was going to get over to Irmo to visit my brother/sister in laws, but I've felt crappy all day. Really need a little longer visit in order to at least try to epoxy one of your cockpit rims in place. I have the large size G-flex, and it's not likely at my age that I'll use it all.

[sbroam]

I hear you, epoxy is the answer some times The G-flex is sounding very promising. Have to see if the West Marine has some...

[ezwater]

Yeah, they have all three forms, the approx. $15 for two small plastic bottles, and the big $50 bottles I got. They also have a pre-thickened form that might be good where one is not using glass or other cloths.

I didn't even bother driving across Atlanta to their store.... I ordered on-line and had them send it. Fast.

Johnsons also has it but I don't like having to "create an account." I'm a no-account. West lets you order online without forcing you to start an account with a password.

G-flex is 1:1 and seems not fussy about mixing errors. I know I was 10% or more on one mix, so I didn't use it, but it set up fine.

[ohioboater]

So, how long does something like G Flex last on the shelf? I bought some during the winter and have only used a small amount so far. Will it last indefinitely in its little bottles, or do I need to throw it out after a set time period?

[ezwater]

I expect it to last for years. My experience with West 105/205 sitting around for more than three years in the basement, with the pumps still in it, is that slight thickening occurs in the resin, while the hardener thickens and gets reddish. But it still meters correctly in the pumps and it still sets up predictably. West's own tests say the same thing.

Since 105/205 is a "hotter" combo than G-flex, I expect it to age faster. Therefore I expect G-flex to last for years.

Probably West has already put G-flex aging data on their website somewhere.

Just remember that G-flex is thicker and takes more care to get it to wet out cloth. But, you have plenty of time because it sets slower.