Outfitting Penobscot 16

[Fleetwalker]

I'm going to try my hand at some downriver racing this year (for fun); this is mostly Class I and easy Class II. I'll be using an OT Penobscot 16, and I'd like to add bow & stern flotation bags to it. Since, this is for fun and I plan to use the boat for other things, I don't want to do anything too extensive to the boat (e.g., remove the seats). On the other hand, I picked up used specifically for this purpose, so a little modification is OK.

I'm specifically wondering what size flotation bags I should be looking for? Should they only extend back as far as the seats? What is the best way to create bag cage lacing attachment points (drill the hull, glue in D-rings, drill the gunwales)?

I've crossed-posted this from the Northeast Paddlers Message Board (NPMB), so I hope anyone who answered me there doesn't get offended if they see it here. I can use all the advice I can get!

For what it's worth, my current thinking is based primarily on http://jbrentoliver.com/camping/canoe_endbags.shtml which corresponds to the advice I received from the NPMB.

Any thoughts are welcome. I'm new at outfitting (I get a little quesy at the thought of drilling a hole in the hull for a grab loop).

Thanks again.

[TNbound]

That seems like a good route to take first. End floats should be sufficient for class I-II stuff. If you are paddling tandem, you could also go with a large float bag in the center as well. I would recommend putting some sort of padding where you plan to be kneeling, both to cushion your knees and to provide some traction. Thin minicell foam would be a pretty good choice.

That is what I would do, but I'm sure other boaters on here have some better input.

[philcanoe]

looks like the generally accepted method....

Personally I'd drill the end grab-loops a bit higher. But only because I think they look low, and for appearance like them a bit higher. Drill right through the ABS for airbags, just a little below the gunwales (as directed) This will not hurt the hull at all, and I've done this many many times. Works really well, as is there are no parts to wear out, and nothing to harm the air bags. Ditto for the grab loops, they'll be extremely strong, resilient, and easily replaceable. Besides this being one of the very best ways to outfit, it is extremely economical.

Click anywhere on this line for WWOCD boat specs

Click anywhere on this line for WWOCD Racing Rules

Click anywhere on this line for General ACA informational page

[horizongfx]

and Don't Use contact Cement to Glue in D-Ring Patches as suggested by the website linked. Use Vinyl Adhesive.

[ice-breaker]

In a large tandem, you can usually only fit about 32" (+/-) end bags. This doesn't give you a whole lot of flotation if the center of the canoe fills with water. I second the advice regarding the centerbag. In my Starburst, we have installed cages for end-bags and for a large centrebag. We have used a "cargo net" made out of webbing to restrain the centre bag. That way, when we are not anticipating needing the centre bag, it can be easily removed to make room for gear. Front and back endcages are conventional parachute cord installed through holes drilled in the royalex just below the gunwales.

regards
dave

[Tim T]

I set up a Mad River Legend with end bags and a center bag. I added knee pads and thigh straps. I really like the thigh straps, even with the standard canoe seat.

[Fleetwalker]

Some of the races include portages (short ones). Would I omit the center bag for those races, or do people carry the boat other than on their shoulders in those circumstances.

Thanks for all the advice; this board is great!

[Paddle Power]

You found an excellent site, but do you Vinyl Adhesive.

[ice-breaker]

Some of the races include portages (short ones). Would I omit the center bag for those races, or do people carry the boat other than on their shoulders in those circumstances.

Thanks for all the advice; this board is great!

if you're racing tandem, you could both carry the canoe during the portages, one front and one rear, leaving the centre bag in place.

[ezwater]

Try vinyl adhesive if you fully understand the drill, but I have had d-ring patches peel off in spite of very careful application. I used G-flex for my most recent patch job.

You might not need or want thigh straps if you just move the center thwart to where it can serve to hold your thighs. Put in a minicell pedestal, also held in by the center thwart, some knee cups, and maybe thigh wedges.

A friend won the Southeastern cruising class on the Nantahala two years in a row in a Penobscot 16, with no knee straps and even less outfitting than I describe.

[Longboatin]

obviously you dont need anymore outfitting then, if the dude won with next to no outfitting, I'd suggest thats part of the reason why. You sometimes need to move around to get the most from yer hull and edges. A saddle limits the usful edges in a longboat.

[ezwater]

That friend, and another, are among those who prefer minimum outfitting. Both have done very well in open boat slalom. I prefer a pedestal, don't move around as much, but dislike thigh straps and toe braces in open boats.

I think "loose" outfitting works better in large boats, while in small OC-1s and in c-1s, tight outfitting is a necessity. My theory is that a large boat provides a platform on which one can move around with some security. In a small boat, moving around can put one beyond the balance zone. It's better in a small boat to be tied in tightly and to use the boat as an extension of your lower body.

[Fleetwalker]

This is a belated thank you to everyone for your advice. The project went well.

If you are interested, you can get a quick glimpse of the outcome at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERtwP8czdE4. It's not a great video when it comes to describing the process, but I find it endearing. The cinematography is in the Blair Witch Project style, so don't watch it on an empty stomach.

For what it's worth, I only did end bags. I swam Stocker's Rapids on the Scantic River over the weekend in my first race, so I have picked up a center bag. I'm thinking of drilling the hull on each side every ~2.5" between the bow and stern seats, weaving parachute cord in and out of the holes, and the then making loops where the cord is on the inside. I figure that gives me tie down points every 5" through which I could weave lacing. There won't be floor tie down points, but I think I can weave the lacing through the grommets on the bag, and nylon webing around the bag and through the lacing to keep it in place fore and aft. This has the advantage of allowing me to move the bag around depending on whether I'm running solo, tandem, or solo w/supercargo (kids are along). Any thoughts?

P.S. In case you are worried, I'm not actually going to run any rapids with the kids in which I would really expect the center bag to come into play, just an added safety feature; and the kids think its cool.