johnd wrote:In California, I encountered considerable prejudice against open boating. I joined Gold Country Paddlers, a club with about 300 people. Right before I left California, I sent out emails to get on a popular Class III run, the South Fork American, but had no takers. Then, on a club organized outing to which I had driven a considerable distance, I couldn't find anyone willing to invite me on a Class III run which was easily within my skill level. It was very frustrating for me, and perhaps if I end up back in California, I will just quit boating. It's not worth the frustration. I don't want to run only Class II runs.
Why do a sport in which people discriminate against you?
Sorry to hear that. I know and paddle with a lot of those guys and I never really encountered any grief. but I'm not much into the "club" paddling scene, too much politics and posturing and carnage. I think it's me giving them the grief
What worked for me was to find a few guys I got along with and go from there.. the circle expands
And i think Jim's post really hit it. Hard truth, but Nobody wants to deal with swimmers all day long.
The kayakers I paddle with see several advantages in paddling with me. In my canoe, I have better visibility down a drop and can alert them to wood or other dangers. I'm faster at getting out of my boat for setting up a throw rope or scouting, and I take better photos and videos of them because I get out of the boat to do it. I also give them an alternative to paddling with yakkers that just want to run the river qucikly and head home. Running with canoes means more emphasis and time for river play. And we stop for lunch. That said, some kayakers hate running with me. And that's cool. The feeling is mutual.
To me the answer is simple. Were stereotyped as a bunch of boaters that can't paddle hard water, and swim every time we flip...
Keep at it. Keep showing up at rivers. You will find people to paddle with if you keep at it.
Make sure you can roll. And don't be the weakest paddler. The rest should fall into place. If you are a fun person to paddle with, they'll learn not to care what your paddling.
...to the rest...Why is it these stereotypes exist?
Really never had an issue with folks boating with me in an OC1 and usually no one says a thing when I show up in a C1... maybe a look or two but nothing negative. Even when solo. I've been around enough to know I paddle my boat and I really don't care as to what folks think one way or the other!
I did have one paddling acquaintance years ago tell me I wasn’t good enough in a OC to paddle with him on the Big Sandy at EHF but I still went and lucky for him I did... let’s just say he'll never live down the stories of that day (note....remember to bring a throw rope and pin kit on epic days )!
I also think the lack of issues is that I have a group of buds who I've "grown with" in terms of paddling over time and I pretty much always boat with them. The nice thing is that it’s a very large group demographically speaking so I pretty much know someone any where I tend to paddle. Might help that I often go out of my way to be friendly and talk to folks on the river – regardless of their skill set too.
Positive vibes, a smile and solid skills always win folks over. Doing a little recon on the area and contacting locals in advance helps too!
Paul C.
Cboats Moderator
Official TOG Member (Team Old Guy)!
I Think a lot of it has to do with the fact that canoes are so rare in cetain areas. Back in the early to mid 90' back in switzerland I was one opf maybe 20 open boaters in the entire country. None of them lived in my area. Many other paddlers had always ever seen tripping canoes and were very surprised to see whitewater boats and people taking them down rapids. I never told people what kind of boat I paddle, but what my skill and experience leve I had. The boat type does, with a few rare exceptions, not matter.
And if some one doesn't want to paddle with you because of the type of boat you are paddling, well then fine, you are probably better off not paddling with them in the first place.
It has actually happened to me both ways, it happened once or twice when kayakers did not want to paddle with me because I showed up in an open boat, but I also remember one day when an open boater did not want to paddle the Upper Gauley with me, simply because that day I had decided to run in in my slalom boat instead of the open canoe...
TGG!
Everyone must believe in something. I believe I'll go canoeing - Henry David Thoreau
Great answers! I am just finding it difficult to get to know people fast enough.
I will not say anything and just meet with folks and see where that takes me.
It's not like I can go every weekend anyway, with climbing, riding and family commitments...but when I do want to go it is really frustrating to be stuck alone.
On another note, I have a great 2 hours paddling alone in a snow blizzard yesterday. Surfing was made really surreal in falling thick snow it really felt a totally hybrid sport
wow, crazy how you all had these experiences and after all, I guess I can feel lucky to have my other half into canoeing as well and some good paddling friends around to go out with... we take kayakers on our trips too. I have not been dependent on kayakers any time for now, although it would probably make things easier / more frequent once we hit up harder rivers.
Hej Erick, if we ever make it to Glasgow with our boats, we'd be happy to paddle with you! Now thats two reasons to go there already ;D
Oh, one point where I'm being discomforted - it's that it will not be possible for us to roll-train in the local swimming pool.. the boats (a local kayak club does it, we'd have to join them too..) are cleaned come winter and then stay at the pool storage room until spring.. now THAT one is too small for our sparks, can't even get there due to cornered corridor. Now, the season also continues in winter... which some seem not to get.. and we'll have to forever dip our heads in freezing cold water to train rolling in the winter. Not happening ;(
Well, at least the chlorine can't damage our gear this way.
Before long you'll be able to name drop companions as well as places n' rivers n' lines n' shuttles, to let unknown folks know that you must be A0K. As for boating primarily with kayakers, that too can be very beneficial as long as they are better than you.
Where I live there are few good OC1 boaters. What happens is most take a solo canoe course get some good swims in, then buy a kayak. Because that's what all the good boaters have. Few see it through. So there always seems to be a lot of beginners around you and nothing else. Even when I'm sitting in an eddy in my OC boat and see a bunch of OC boats coming I think "oh great". Because half of them will flip in the wave and will be chasing them and their gear down river the rest of the run. But on the other side of that coin there are the good ones. If you can roll, surf, read lines and do your part on the river you get all the respect. Getting your first big surf usually results in cheering from total strangers where I live. Even if your still learning and pushing yourself its great. Just don't relay on other people to take care of you. Understand your responsibility to the group and it will be fine. You watch there backs and they'll watch yours. Swimmer buy beer here so people don't mind helping I love not being like every other boater on the river. So keep at it and show them how it's done! [/quote]
problem to me...
I love not being like every other boater on the river. So keep at it and show them how it's done!