Hi all,
I made a post on this subject last night that doesn't seem to have gone through, I'm trying again and will save a copy this time.
The title of "semi-update" was picked because I have a lot less info on my Fink than I planned on having at this point. We did go up to Quebec for Memorial Day but didn't do a lot of boating. We put on the Donnaconna section of the JC which was running at about 270cms and had a member of our party take a long swim very early in the run. After that I was leading down looking for the easiest line with no stops to play. We then went to the Parc section of the JC but only hiked for the next few days.
I'm still having a bit of outfitting trouble with the Fink, probably a combination of my inexperience with strapless systems and my short stubby legs. My butt is still coming off the seat a few inches when I roll. No real troubles so far, but I'm not very confident in the situation if I had to make multiple attempts or was spun a few times.
I moved the seat itself forward as far as I could and still have some plastic for the top screw to go into. After that I added a couple of layers of foam to the back of the seat so in total I'm moved around 3-4 inches forward. I've added foam wedges to the top of the bulkhead for additional contact area, before my legs were only touching at the forward edge. The seat had earlier been cut down about an inch. It's still a very tight squeeze to get between the beavertails so adding to them doesn't seem to be an option.
Any suggestions? Move the bulkhead back like I did the pedestal? Add still more foam to the seatback? A different shape for the beavertails? I'll be working on it this week and will give a further report.
I was too big a wuss to take the Fink to the Bottom Moose for the last release so I'll need to wait for rain to try it on something steep.
For anyone interested in New England, I am planning on paddling the Deerfield Dryway both days on the upcoming weekend. Anyone would be welcome to hop in and give it a try at some point. At a guess we'll be doing two runs so there will be a fair bit of flexibility as far as schedule.
Once I'm solid in the Fink I think I will really like it, feels amazingly maneuverable for such a high volume boat. It is also lightweight compared to the Atom, probably because it doesn't have the heavy rotomolded cockpit and hip huggers Dagger used.
Don
Fink Semi-Update
Moderators: kenneth, sbroam, TheKrikkitWars, Mike W., Sir Adam, KNeal, PAC, adamin
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tim
I only demo'ed a finki and have long legs sooo the stock out fit was ok, But lots of foam added to the bulkhead seems like a requirement. The Knee hole must slope with your leg. Toe blocks might help. I always end up with straps if I want a sure fit and I think that will help the Finki. the down side is it is more fooling around outfitting. 
The fink is worth the effort to make it right.
Cheers
Tim
CU ina C1
The fink is worth the effort to make it right.
Cheers
Tim
CU ina C1
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Don Williams
- C Boater
- Posts: 44
- Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2003 2:44 pm
Hi Tim,
The wedges I put in do follow the slope of my leg pretty well, may make some more adjustments to them after I get the basic outfitting better. I used double sided tape to attach them so I can remove them without tearing up everything.
Right now the main problem seems to be getting far enough into the bulkhead. I'll probably try to move the bulkhead itself back a bit, I can't go much further forward and still have my skirt fit.
All of my other boats have had toe blocks, I'm sure I'll add them. At this point the problem isn't sliding back out of the knee holes, more that there isn't enough of my leg inside of them.
I'm going to try a bit more to make the bulkhead system work, the rodeo OC-1 folks seem to be pretty snug in their outfitting and they seem to be mainly in strapless systems.
Still planning on being on the Deerfield Dryway this weekend, let me know if anyone wants to hop in and paddle it at some point.
Don
The wedges I put in do follow the slope of my leg pretty well, may make some more adjustments to them after I get the basic outfitting better. I used double sided tape to attach them so I can remove them without tearing up everything.
Right now the main problem seems to be getting far enough into the bulkhead. I'll probably try to move the bulkhead itself back a bit, I can't go much further forward and still have my skirt fit.
All of my other boats have had toe blocks, I'm sure I'll add them. At this point the problem isn't sliding back out of the knee holes, more that there isn't enough of my leg inside of them.
I'm going to try a bit more to make the bulkhead system work, the rodeo OC-1 folks seem to be pretty snug in their outfitting and they seem to be mainly in strapless systems.
Still planning on being on the Deerfield Dryway this weekend, let me know if anyone wants to hop in and paddle it at some point.
Don
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the great gonzo
- Paddling Benefactor
- Posts: 1718
- Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 2:03 am
- Location: Montréal, Québec
Don,
I don't know if you ever took the outfitting completely out of your FM, but if you want to move your bulkhead back you will have to take it out completely and buil it up at the back where it rests against the foam pillar to prevent it from sliding back too far into the hull. The screw on the top will not really hold it in place if there is a void between the back of the bulkhead and the foam pillar.
Another option would be to add foam to the front of the bulkhead to make it fit you.
Play around a bit with the whole outfitting, the bulkhead/beaver tail outfitting works extremely well for me (long skinny legs), and once properly outfitted you may find that there is absolutely no need for any kind of straps to keep you inside and that toe blocks are not really needed.
martin
I don't know if you ever took the outfitting completely out of your FM, but if you want to move your bulkhead back you will have to take it out completely and buil it up at the back where it rests against the foam pillar to prevent it from sliding back too far into the hull. The screw on the top will not really hold it in place if there is a void between the back of the bulkhead and the foam pillar.
Another option would be to add foam to the front of the bulkhead to make it fit you.
Play around a bit with the whole outfitting, the bulkhead/beaver tail outfitting works extremely well for me (long skinny legs), and once properly outfitted you may find that there is absolutely no need for any kind of straps to keep you inside and that toe blocks are not really needed.
martin
Everyone must believe in something. I believe I'll go canoeing - Henry David Thoreau
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Don Williams
- C Boater
- Posts: 44
- Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2003 2:44 pm
Thanks Martin, I had noticed the need for some additional foam when I moved the pedestal forward. I'm using sticky tape for most of my modifications so I can play around with it until I'm satisfied. I do hope to get the bulkhead working for me, for one thing it would mean folks wouldn't be waiting for me while I fiddle with straps.
BTW, wherever I saw the Deerfield Dryway was releasing both days this weekend was wrong, the release is only on Sunday. Still planning on being there for Sunday.
Don
BTW, wherever I saw the Deerfield Dryway was releasing both days this weekend was wrong, the release is only on Sunday. Still planning on being there for Sunday.
Don
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Tim
don,
As Martin suggests, adding foam to the back of the bulkhead (the cockpit side) is an easy way to get into the bulkhead farther. Even just add a half circle to cap your thighs. I wouldn't be too worried about slapping the contact cement around, it can always be cut out or off again. Eventually moving the bulkhead back will make a tight squeeze getting out. Lots of those rodeo bulkhead paddlers around here would also use a seat belt when they really want to stay in.
Looking forward in your paddling report/reveiw.
CU ina C1
cheers
Tim
As Martin suggests, adding foam to the back of the bulkhead (the cockpit side) is an easy way to get into the bulkhead farther. Even just add a half circle to cap your thighs. I wouldn't be too worried about slapping the contact cement around, it can always be cut out or off again. Eventually moving the bulkhead back will make a tight squeeze getting out. Lots of those rodeo bulkhead paddlers around here would also use a seat belt when they really want to stay in.
Looking forward in your paddling report/reveiw.
CU ina C1
cheers
Tim
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Don Williams
- C Boater
- Posts: 44
- Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2003 2:44 pm
First, I've posted another couple of photos of the fink here:
http://groups.msn.com/MiddleForkSalmon2 ... scade.msnw
The shadows do a pretty good job of making the chine and the angle of the side show up.
I finally got the chance to really play around with the Fink on the Deerfield Dryway Sunday. The outfitting is still a bit of a work in progress, I'm lifting off the seat and it isn't easy to get out.
It is improved and I'm pretty hopeful I'll have it in even better shape for the coming weekend. Have you carved any particular angle or shape into the beavertails? I've put a bit of an angle on them so that the pads are thicker on top.
Since a lot of the variations in the responses to the Fink seem to depend on what the boater has been paddling I'll add some of my background so you can add whatever quantities of salt seem appropriate. My experience in flat bottomed rodeo boats is very limited, I've hopped in one a few times. I'm usually in an Atom for most rivers, but switch to my Cascade for creeks or runs like the Bottom Moose.
Either boat is fine for big water, on my two Grand Canyon trips I paddled a Cascade and was happy with it. the first trip the Atom didn't exist yet, for the second Canyon REO had a Cascade in their lot so no shipping charges. Plus it was nice to be able to pop the skirt and sit on the back deck for the flat sections, how's that for a design criteria.
I used to paddle a squirt boat (Acrobat) or race boat but have been in Tupperware for quite a few years.
For anyone not from around here the Dryway is the New England equivalent of the Ocoee, releasing during the summer with most drops rated III and a couple of IVs (although they would not be IV someplace like Idaho). Ok, on to the review!
First off, the boat attains and ferries very well. Not quite like a race boat but better than almost everything else out there. The fat bow doesn't want to bury the way an Atom's would, and ferry angles are easy to correct while it still carves nicely.
As others have mentioned, it punches holes very well. It cuts through with very little resistance, doesn't go deep, and despite the long flat tail I didn't notice any particular tendency to backender.
I did miss a couple of eddys when the bow was pushed around by cross currents and swirlies more than I expected. I think the problem was my paddling more than any real problem with the boat. An Atom tends to slice through those kind of things, the Cascade lumbers its way through. The Fink is a big boat but turns amazingly easily so I was a bit behind on the curve.
I need to go now but will post more later. I'm going to be back on the Dryway this weekend, as before anyone who wants to hop in and try it will be welcome.
http://groups.msn.com/MiddleForkSalmon2 ... scade.msnw
The shadows do a pretty good job of making the chine and the angle of the side show up.
I finally got the chance to really play around with the Fink on the Deerfield Dryway Sunday. The outfitting is still a bit of a work in progress, I'm lifting off the seat and it isn't easy to get out.
It is improved and I'm pretty hopeful I'll have it in even better shape for the coming weekend. Have you carved any particular angle or shape into the beavertails? I've put a bit of an angle on them so that the pads are thicker on top.
Since a lot of the variations in the responses to the Fink seem to depend on what the boater has been paddling I'll add some of my background so you can add whatever quantities of salt seem appropriate. My experience in flat bottomed rodeo boats is very limited, I've hopped in one a few times. I'm usually in an Atom for most rivers, but switch to my Cascade for creeks or runs like the Bottom Moose.
Either boat is fine for big water, on my two Grand Canyon trips I paddled a Cascade and was happy with it. the first trip the Atom didn't exist yet, for the second Canyon REO had a Cascade in their lot so no shipping charges. Plus it was nice to be able to pop the skirt and sit on the back deck for the flat sections, how's that for a design criteria.
I used to paddle a squirt boat (Acrobat) or race boat but have been in Tupperware for quite a few years.
For anyone not from around here the Dryway is the New England equivalent of the Ocoee, releasing during the summer with most drops rated III and a couple of IVs (although they would not be IV someplace like Idaho). Ok, on to the review!
First off, the boat attains and ferries very well. Not quite like a race boat but better than almost everything else out there. The fat bow doesn't want to bury the way an Atom's would, and ferry angles are easy to correct while it still carves nicely.
As others have mentioned, it punches holes very well. It cuts through with very little resistance, doesn't go deep, and despite the long flat tail I didn't notice any particular tendency to backender.
I did miss a couple of eddys when the bow was pushed around by cross currents and swirlies more than I expected. I think the problem was my paddling more than any real problem with the boat. An Atom tends to slice through those kind of things, the Cascade lumbers its way through. The Fink is a big boat but turns amazingly easily so I was a bit behind on the curve.
I need to go now but will post more later. I'm going to be back on the Dryway this weekend, as before anyone who wants to hop in and try it will be welcome.
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Don Williams
- C Boater
- Posts: 44
- Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2003 2:44 pm
Since I was still unhappy with the original Fink outfitting after a lot of fiddling with it I decided to put in a Dagger console I had around. One of the motivations was that by moving myself so far forward in order to get more solidly into the bulkhead I had made the boat quite nose heavy.
The console isn't ideal since it adds a fair bit of weight but it is working very well for me right now. With my weight back it is no longer getting pushed around by the swirlies and it is surfing much better. Probably because I'm used to that kind of outfitting I feel much more in control of the boat and don't even notice the low initial stability.
I'm going to the Ottawa next weekend so I'll be able to give a big water report. Probably no creeking, unless Garvin's counts.
The console isn't ideal since it adds a fair bit of weight but it is working very well for me right now. With my weight back it is no longer getting pushed around by the swirlies and it is surfing much better. Probably because I'm used to that kind of outfitting I feel much more in control of the boat and don't even notice the low initial stability.
I'm going to the Ottawa next weekend so I'll be able to give a big water report. Probably no creeking, unless Garvin's counts.
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the great gonzo
- Paddling Benefactor
- Posts: 1718
- Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 2:03 am
- Location: Montréal, Québec
! I'll be staying at RiverRun.-
Don Williams
- C Boater
- Posts: 44
- Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2003 2:44 pm
Hey Martin,
"Look for a poorely paddled yellow FM with blue swirls ! I'll be staying at RiverRun."
That includes me as well! Even to the boat color, we'll have to get a photo of them together. Our reservations are for the "pet haven" area at River Run. Three of us will be driving up Friday and staying until Thursday, two more are scheduled to show up Sunday, and there may be some more arrivals.
I'll be interested in seeing your outfitting, you obviously did a much better job with the bulkhead than I did. I was very happy with the Fink last weekend, it felt like a normal (in a good way) boat rather than an exciting experiment.
"Look for a poorely paddled yellow FM with blue swirls ! I'll be staying at RiverRun."
That includes me as well! Even to the boat color, we'll have to get a photo of them together. Our reservations are for the "pet haven" area at River Run. Three of us will be driving up Friday and staying until Thursday, two more are scheduled to show up Sunday, and there may be some more arrivals.
I'll be interested in seeing your outfitting, you obviously did a much better job with the bulkhead than I did. I was very happy with the Fink last weekend, it felt like a normal (in a good way) boat rather than an exciting experiment.