C1 Creeking - Safe outfitting

mccabekev · Post by **mccabekev** » Sun Aug 21, 2011 5:59 pm

After 2 years of c1 playboating, I am about to start outfitting my first c1 creeker - a Prijon Cross.

I have decided for safer, quicker exits I will forgo straps and instead install a bulkhead.

The thing I am currently trying to sort out, is what to use for foot blocks/pegs. Not sure whether to glue blocks to the base of the boat or try to get adjustable pegs similar to those with the Spanish Fly (and most other OC-1s)

What are peoples experiences of using these? I want to be sure I can stay in the boat and roll, and still I want to be able to get out very fast without running the risk of foot entrapment

xmas0c1c1k1 · Post by **xmas0c1c1k1** » Sun Aug 21, 2011 9:39 pm

from my experience pegs are a no go in c1s some people have them but i don't think they are as safe in a c1 it is hard to move your feet in a c1. you can prob get a bulkhead to hold you in with feet flat. also consider a strap system with a quick release

mccabekev · Post by **mccabekev** » Sun Aug 21, 2011 9:44 pm

Thanks - I use qr straps in my playboat so don't have a problem using them.

But anytime i have taken a swim creeking in a kayak I normally haven't the time to attempt a roll, much less remove straps so I want a solution that will let me get out quicker than a fart

xmas0c1c1k1 · Post by **xmas0c1c1k1** » Sun Aug 21, 2011 9:52 pm

i use something like this
http://store.crowleys.com/servlet/-strs ... 7AodEkiL-w

I connect my thigh straps to it and run a small peice of webbing from the qr to flop out of the front of the cockpit so when I pull my skirt i can release the straps at the same time
im with you when i want out i want out fast this has worked well for me

Larry Horne · Post by **Larry Horne** » Sun Aug 21, 2011 10:05 pm

i'm going to argue that for a c1 creeker, thigh straps with airplane buckles and snowboard knee straps is the best setup i've seen.

You're held in place close to the hips, and down on the knees, and can release completely and instantly. If set up correctly (in my opinion) you don't need to release any straps to get out. But at least you have the option if you need it.
Stiff knee straps don't ever need to be fiddled with when you get in or out of the boat, they're like a low bulkhead that is adjustable.

Straps are adjustable and don't have to be super tight, so it's comfy to paddle for hours. No matter what you're wearing.
Bukheads are not.

The main thing about Bulkheads in c1 is they don't hold you in well if you can't push or wedge yourself into them. With a 5-6" saddle, i think it's impossible to push yourself in with your feet. You may be able to wedge yourself in, but then that's not very safe.

For it to keep you secure without the foot pressure, the bulkhead would have to be so far up your leg that the cockpit is mostly filled with outfitting foam/ thwarts and such.... entrapment becomes an issue. Not to mention lack of places to keep a throwbag and safety kit handy.

A c1 cockpit with thigh straps and stiff (snowboard) knee straps is roomy and uncluttered, and easier to get out of in a bad sitution.

TheKrikkitWars · Post by **TheKrikkitWars** » Sun Aug 21, 2011 10:25 pm

xmas0c1c1k1 wrote:i use something like this
http://store.crowleys.com/servlet/-strs ... 7AodEkiL-w

I connect my thigh straps to it and run a small peice of webbing from the qr to flop out of the front of the cockpit so when I pull my skirt i can release the straps at the same time
im with you when i want out i want out fast this has worked well for me

I also use this system, it's excellent, and releases roughly as easily as just popping your deck. It's also fail-safe in that if the buckle breaks, the pin holding it shut falls out meaning you won't get stuck in the event of it malfunctioning.

I've always held, that in not being held into your boat, you're actually taking a far bigger risk*, because there are plenty of places where slipping out of your outfitting could be dangerous and plenty of holes that will give you an unpleasant beatdown and shake you out of loose outfitting, when with good straps, you could fight your way out with realative ease compared to taking a long and risky swim down something steep and rocky.

*Risk is dictated by conciquence and likely hood thus whilst the objective danger represented by drowning is much higher than that of taking a severe beating, the actual likelyhood of a strap related drowning [if you make and practice using a decent quick release system] is almost zero; but we all know that the next potential beating is just over that hard to scout horizon line...

xmas0c1c1k1 · Post by **xmas0c1c1k1** » Sun Aug 21, 2011 10:36 pm

I agree with larry and use a setup just like his but i connect the thighstraps to a snap shackle just for a but quicker release I like to be very tight in my boat and don't like falling out when flailing. for me its also a mental thing i like knowing that when i pull it will be instant i also use airplane buckles in case something goes on with the qr.

cheajack · Post by **cheajack** » Sun Aug 21, 2011 11:05 pm

Snow bard bindings for knees and Brown Quick Release thigh straps in a Karnali L. Endf result is very similar to Larry's. In a WS Z with a Gyramax saddle I have 1" webbing with neopreme sleeves (Mike Yee) for knees that pass through the loops in the saddle to Brown QR straps for thigh straps. One pull per side gets both.

philcanoe · Post by **philcanoe** » Mon Aug 22, 2011 12:55 am

this is what i've attempted, using a standard canoe saddle....

(details in link) http://cboats.net/cforum/viewtopic.php? ... 96&start=9

Rear thwart has since been modified to allow a longer legged and larger footed (size 11.5) friend to wet exit. Although it was fine for me in before pics. This would indeed be the first thing to test. Saddle has been cut down to 10inches farther back, and foam behind back modified. Finally knee blocks were added to inside of each knee, as there was a wee little too much side movement when rolling. Ocoee run tomorrow will tell the tale.

now==>

Post by **sbroam** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:59 am

Phil's project got me thinking...

The key reason I've never done a full buklhead with footpegs in a C-1 is I'd never had that set up work 100% for me in an open boat. Well, now I've got the SF working with bulkhead alone and I really like it. And on further reflection, I'd never really thought it would work in a C-1 is because I need a higher seat to deal with the foot angle to use footpegs - straps have allowed me to be secure while having my feet completely flat.

But... I just bumped up the seat in my Remix to a hair over 8" because my feet have been going to sleep. That is a hair taller than the seat in my SF... I'm not going to redo the Remix, but the next conversion might just be a bulkhead with foot pegs...