Mad River Howler for big water (Grand Canyon)?

[jnorto01]

Would the Howler make a good big water boat ( solo oufitted), up to and including the Grand Canyon?

How would it compare to a solo outfitted Caption for this use?

[KNeal]

A guy in Richmond ran the Grand Canyon in a Howler back in the 90's. He made it successfully but admitted that he had to work the boat hard to stay upright. He has a bigger frame (plus body weight) than you so that may make a difference on how nimble the boat is. I saw a great pic of him riding up Hermit in that boat.

[Walsh]

Jim, the Howler paddled solo feels like an enormous Spark. The speed is awesome, but it's only 28" wide with no tumblehome at the center, and not a lot of volume in the bow. It has hard chines (as in the hull sides and bottom form nearly a 90 degree angle). Unless you are willing to work for the lines, it's not a particularly dry design.

You could get a lot of performance out of it, but it's going to take a little more mojo. You could go anywhere you wanted on the river, but it will not be as dry or forgiving as a Caption.

[Dale Barton]

Paddled a ME down GC 1988, pulled gunnells in to 25 inches for racing, had a great time . but I think with a good roll and pump the Caption woild be a more stable(but not as fun}boat on the GC.(Disclaimer: I have never paddled a Howler except in a slolam race}

[Roy]

I think it depends quite a lot on what kind of paddler you are. If you are a low-brace, get-flushed-here, get-flushed-there, kind of paddler, then the Caption would be pretty ideal. On the other hand, if you are an on-line all-the-time person who always gets the boat where it needs to be in big pushy water...well, the Howler would be fine.

Paddler weight will have an impact, of course. Also, some people have a hard time moving the Caption, solo, due to its width. A long torso helps.

Splitting the difference might have you there in an Encore.

Bob Connolly designed the Big Boy specifically for a GC trip; he found the Big Boy to be ideal there. The Big Boy is about 13' x 30" wide...a lot closer to the Caption than the Howler. Bob is a pretty big guy.

The really good news is that one can find rivers in the east to test various GC boats. I am sure you could find suitable levels on the New. The higher flows on the Kennebec are ideal, too. It would stink to start a GC trip and realize after a swim in Hanz that you brought the wrong boat (yes, I know that for a FACT).

Roy

[jnorto01]

I'm 170 lbs. I paddle a Zoom (not a Wooz when I'm in it ) and an InaZone 240 C1. I'm not looking for or needing a babysitter boat. That said, I don't have a lot of big water experience. I'm just trying to figure out if this Howler will be a good addition to the collection. Might just have to get it and see.

"just one more"

[ezwater]

I have a Millbrook Big Boy, or "Edsel" as I have renamed it after Kaz suspended production.

The Big Boy shares two thing with the Howler, to a small extent. First, it is mildly fishform. Second, it has chines, round chines like the Howler. After that, they are not very similar. Connolly banked the very high sides inward a bit, probably to make it easier for a paddler to reach the water. The bottom is flattish, not dead flat. One oddity perhaps not related to the Grand Canyon is a small angular break across the hull, under the paddler. Occasionally in more normal rivers, that break can trip on things. Maybe it contributes to the boat's pretty good surfing behavior.

Though shorter and more rockered, the Big Boy seems about as fast as my 15' MR Synergy. The BB is quite maneuverable for a 13' boat, unless there's a strong wind, when it goes one direction.

[sbroam]

I wonder with the Howler if you wouldn't end up at the mercy of the wind. As I recall, it's pretty assymetrical and you might have more "sail" at one end than the other... Folks I've talked to who have open boated the canyon all talked about the wind in the flats...