C-Forum

I mean the real kind, no hand switching. Got a completely bomb proof onside roll that always works in my OC-1 or my slalom C1, but I never could get the idea in my head about how to do an offside roll. I read some of the decriptions of cross bow rolls (aka bowmans roll) but I still can't visualize the mechanics of this beast. Any suggestions?

On a lake I have. Two different ways once each. The first, the way your supposed to do it, it took a lot of concentration that I was able to muster that one time. The second time, on a different day, I rolled up on my offside with my onside setup. It took alot of over extension or I should say I hurt my shoulder and never tried again. I don't see where I would need one. I have never been in a river situation where one is required. If you have followed the posts on the bombproof roll, the most common fact is most c-1'rs flip to their offside almost never to their onside, and the momentum of that roll is so quick that they are up before moving far at all. K-1'rs on the otherhand do not benfit from momentum, the setup is more focused and time and energy consuming. Our kayaking friends may feel the need to have a two sided roll. But they have an advantage in that they don't have to change hands. The same part of the shaft is in their hands either way. If you really were in a situation where you needed that offside roll I bet you could do it, its amazing how focused you can be when the situation demands it.

Well, thats my biased and uninformed opinion.
till next
Jim

I tried to learn it during the pool sessioms last winter, and was never sucessful. I talked to Joe Langman about it during a pool session, and he pretty much told me to forget about it. Hesaid that pretty much the only time you need it is when you are sidesurfing a hole on your offside and flip, but because the water coming into the hole actually helps you rolling, you don't really have to be able to roll, since the river willpretty much do it for you. He sayd that's the only time he does it, other thannthat it's always an onside roll.
Joe suggested that I reaaly worked on perfecting my onside roll, this is way more importani on the river.

martin

Just some thoughts on when you might need an offside roll:

1. playing in holes (offside side surfing, spinning, etc. and wanted to stay in the hole with a quick offside roll when you flip). Of course the advantage here is that it should be far easier as the water will actually help you out if you can keep yourself oriented.

2. Anytime you can't get your paddle free and clear on your onside, e.g. if you are against a rock. In this case, if you don't have an offside roll, your alternative is swimming, which isn't always the best idea.

3. If you are upside down and your onside is upstream - in lesser currents you can probably still roll, but managing to do so in a very strong current is far more difficult.

Now, having said all this, I don't have an offside roll (or a hand roll actually - which is also a very good back up to have ready) in either a C1 or an OC1. I've got close, but never really got it figured out. Back when I used two blades, I did have an offside roll, and in five years of frequent paddling don't believe I ever needed to use it. Was it a good thing to have? To be sure, but it's like any other piece of "safety equipment", most of the time we don't need to use it. I'm definitely going to be trying to find mine this winter in the pool.

Years ago I had an offside ("cross") roll, using the backside of the paddle face. It was easy to do in a pool (although hard on my shoulder) but pretty useless on the river. If I was caught in a hole upside down on my offside, the blade angled up out of the water - not effective to catch the current below the backwash. Mostly I just hung my body straight down and hoped that the current would drag me out of the hole eventually. Because of the unusual blade angle, the cross roll would actually be pretty effective rolling upstream. Of course, in the same situation, you could do a conventional roll on the downstream side, negating any unique value...

The backside brace is pretty effective if done quickly before you fall over to your offside, but if you wait too long, you're better off to go completely around with a conventional roll.

I have actually given up on trying the offside (cross) roll in the pool, i.m.o. the mechanics of it are, particularly in an open boat, just too unfavorable , particularly towards the end of it. I will practice rolling when paddling on my offside though. If I need it, I'll just change hands (that's at least my plan....)

martin