C-Forum

Here we go,

I own a Pyrahna Fly for river play a CU Fly for freestyle, a Wheelboy and am now looking for a C1 creeker, would the new Drakkar Big Boy be a better machine than a Robson Finky for river running and creeking?

Col

Col,

I haven't paddled a Big Boy yet, but based on all the info and reviews I have seen it's essentially a bigger Wheelboy, which i own, so this makes it a playboat for bigger paddlers (the Drakkar creeker everyone is waiting for is the Fatboy, but that one is tstill in developement, I guess...).
The Finkenmeister however is a dedicated riverrunner/creeker and is great at this. It may be a bit big for smaller paddlers, but for me at ~190 lbs it's perfect.

martin a.k.a. The Great Gonzo!

As always Martin is dead on the money- The Bigboy is currently only available in glass, and it is essentially a large wheelboy.

Ironically, in my opinion Drakkar needs the kayak business to do well so they can afford to produce cboats. I hope we see the Fatboy this year.

Bill

How would you distinguish the Finkenmeister from the Dagger Atom as a creeker, Martin ? From the shape they seem similar.

Atom's appear easier to come by and without the negative comments by some for the Finkenmeister.

Thanks

Chuck

Chuck,

having paddled an Atom as well for a few years before getting the FM i prefer the FM for creeking hands down.
Altough only about 4 inches shorter, it turns significantly better than the Atom, due to its increased rocker.
Due to the increased rocker, it also boofs better than the Atom.
The FM has more volume and tends to be moer on the surface than the Atom.
Due to the higher volume it also doesn't go as deep as the Atom after running bigger drops and due to the significant arch in the deck it resurfaces much better.
The slightly shorter and differently shaped stern reduces significantly the tendency to back ender when punching bigger holes.
Due to the highly flared sides and deck edges high above the water it is much more predictable in boily and turbulent water and less 'grabby'.

It is however, due to the higher volume and increased width, somewhat harder to roll. Good technique is crucial. Adding thigh straps to the boat tremendously helps rolling it consistently.
It has less primary stability than the Atom, i.e. it feels more 'wobbly' when you initially get in. However secondary stability once moving or on edge is definitely higher than on the Atom.

It is a bit slower than the Atom, but not all that significantly. It tracks virtually as good as the Atom once you engage the edge, but spins much better when flat in the water.

The outfitting however needs to be modified, i.e. you really have to put in thigh straps to get maximum control out of the boat.

Overall the benefits of the FM outhweigh its drawbacks when compared to the Atom significantly, particularly for creeking.

martin a.k.a. the great gonzo!

Martin,
Nice job on the comparison between the Atom and Fink. I have paddled both extensively and I agree with your conclusions .
SYOTR,
Bruce

If Id had a buck for everytime my atom has stern squirted on critical moves....

On the other hand, squits are FUN!!!

Atom definitely has a "wet" edge.

HI

I say no for bigboy for creeking.

Here is what will happen. Even though BB is bigger and much more on the surface than WB creating more speed and stability there is going to be big trashing. @ your weight with WB you can sub out of holes and trashy waves etc. and with BB you find freestyling on every imaginable figure and very much out control. Flat will keep it loose and fast.... ends will keep it vertical..... and extra width will give hard time edging out of gragly spots..... and that volume will make you stick in holes for extended periods of time.

Had atom not for creeking ... Don.t like finky balance much but it is better creeker ... maybe the big old cascade .. I'd like that

Hi Marko,
It is good to hear from you. The Cascade is the best C1 creeker I have paddled - but it is a little long. Right now I am doing fairly well with the Finkenmeister, but I am almost sorry I sold the Cascade . I am definitely looking forward to the Fatboy .
Regards,
Bruce Farrenkopf

NEVER ever sell a boat you like .... you will miss it

NEVER ever sell a boat you like .... you will miss it

True words to live by

i have paddled both, though by no comparison as extensively as Martin, and still dont have a bomber roll. but i can definetely suggest the thigh straps. i made an uber simple set up involving a 2x4 and some straps and 2 bolts. whammy! i havent gotten to test it in the water because Robson USA HASN'T SENT MY F(*&ING SKIRT BACK! YET. but apparently it's on the way. so after 5 months of being skirtless ill finally be able to paddle the boat, and go upside down again. and im really excited to see how it goes.

the only real pertinant note i have to add to the review from martin(which is very accurate) is that when in big (which for me is 3+, to 4-) it helps to be paddled from the bow. I am alot bigger of a paddler, or was a lot bigger of a paddler before the winter at about 225 with the gear. now probably 200 with gear, and am excited to see how it goes. and i found that in very turbulent holes with wicked boil lines, i would occasionally drop my stern, and accidently get into a bit of a stern squirt.
but it is an AWESOME boat.
hope this helps
ps, i just turned 19.
cheers
-isaac

Isaac,

Happy B-day!

Great point you made about having to paddle the FM from the bow. I forgot to mention that, simply because I tend to paddle every boat from the bow.
The handling of the FM suck when you don't paddle it like that. A friend of mine has paddled mine several times and he hates it, no matter wheter with thighstraps or without, and says it's handling is 'awkward', but the real problem is that he paddles it from the stern and works a lot with stern pries and similar strokes.
Apparently the designer, Thomas Fink, is or was also a slalom boater and it shows.
Paddling it from the bow also helps to release the long stern for really fast turns for a boat of it's size, while leaning back a tad engeges the long stern edge to help hold ferry engles and increase speed.

I noticed the same thing as Isaac in bigger holes, just as you think 'oh, this one's gonna stop me', the stern sinks a bit, not really a squirt, but it seems to be just enough for the tip to grab the green water and help you get out. Cool feeling!

The more I paddle the boat, the better I understand it's design features and the better I am able to use them.

martin a.k.a. the great gonzo!

i definetely thought that the boat was very hard to handle, and extremely difficult to paddle when i was just beginning, making my choices of river very tentative, but when i began to have to do 4-5 foot seal drops off the dock to get into the lake to practice, i began to realize the stability that it has. the edges are definetely a benefit for ferrying because you can just do power strokes and ride the downstream edge, and get away with a good ferry. im definetely excited to paddle alot this spring, and i really wish i had a boat with me right now.
its about 55+ degrees here in tahoe, not good for skiing. not at all
cheers
-isaac

NEVER ever sell a boat you like .... you will miss it

yeah bruce, you should be breaking boats you like. not selling them!!


with all this talk on how to paddle the fink, can we rename it finikymeister