Mastering the short boatsAnother single blade
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Mastering the short boatsAnother single blade
Another single blade convert and its good to be back home.Need some opinions on those who have paddled the Zoom and also the Dadder Cascade. Dont everyone talk at one time. Just kidding. New member, old school paddler. D-Caption
Zoom
a very responsive boat.
Stability will take a few days but its best not to try to keep the boat flat but to paddle with a tilt to one side or the other.
Edges are less grabby than the Ocoee.
Super dry ride, but you better stay active and on top of it or roll practice will be in order.
Stability will take a few days but its best not to try to keep the boat flat but to paddle with a tilt to one side or the other.
Edges are less grabby than the Ocoee.
Super dry ride, but you better stay active and on top of it or roll practice will be in order.
Paddled one for a year before going to something slightly bigger. It is very manuverable, very dry, loves creeks and drops. It takes a while to get used to it, so give it time. Primary stability is poor but secondary is good. It surfs pretty good too. It will make you a better paddler or a good swimmer.
Mr T Grips Jim P Craig Thanks for thr quick response to my post about the Zoom. I currently paddle the Dagger Caption and love it . I paddled a Zepher for one season and just could not get comfortable with the agressive edges in the more challenging water ie class 3. Do any of you know if the edges on the Zoom are less radical than the Zepher. I have probably gotten spoiled in the 14 foot Caption because it surfs so well and punches the big holes with ease because of its length and extreme rocker. I am also considering some type of c-1 or conversion such as the Critical Mass, dagger cascade or a Fink. I fell like I need the extra width for stability. Any suggestions would be appreciated very much. My Zepher is in the shed collecting dust and still in mint condition and willing to trade for somthing I can use that I feel comfortable in. thanks D- Caption
Masterint the short boats
How about the Prelude.Surley if Dooley can run the Raven in it it must be easy to paddle ....just kidding...I am not a creeker but sometimes run smaller stuff with lots of rain. Looking for something aesier on the portage and takeout, the reason I am considering a C-1 or smaller canoe. Hope I am not taking up too much of your time thanks D-Caption
If you want something short, light, and responsive, but with decent primary stability, you might want to look at something like a Taureau/Spanish Fly/Quake...
My Quake has has a lot better primary stability than my Ocoee, and is not nearly as grabby with the edges. And it doesn't weigh much more than a kayak/C1.
My Quake has has a lot better primary stability than my Ocoee, and is not nearly as grabby with the edges. And it doesn't weigh much more than a kayak/C1.
Mastering the short boats
Hey Nessmuk, do you have any pics of your Quake you could post or email to me? thanks D-Caption
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squeakyknee
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I own 2 Ocoees, used to own a Cascade and have paddled the Zoom and Zepher. I would disagree with Jim P on the Zoom edges... I think they are much more aggressive than the Ocoee's. I love the Ocoee's edges and the ability to carve and think it's THE boat for me. But if they made a Zoom that was just a tad bigger, I would buy it. I am 6'3" and 190 and it just doesn't feel big enough. There are people like Andrew Westwood, who is my size that makes it work but he is an exceptional paddler. D- Caption, you did not mention your height and weight... certainly a consideration if you are my size or bigger. The Cascade if pretty darn heavy and not very exciting to paddle. Look for an Atom or even better, a Fink. I have paddled one of those a little and would pick one up used if the oppurtunity came along. It seemed like a great boat. Last comment... 15 years ago, I would have thought the Zepher was a great boat but is fairly boring to me compared to an Ocoee. I will say it has some positives worth mentioning. Great secondary stability, fairly dry and the best feature, light weight. It does not have edges to speak of. I would also recommend it over boats such as the Outrage and Rival. Since I own a Caption as well, I am going to put in another plug for the Ocoee (which I do regularly on this forum). The Ocoee is very much like a Caption in design, only 3 feet shorter. The edges are more aggressive but once you learn to use them to your advantage you would love it. But then again if the Zepher was spanking you a bit, the Ocoee will be harder still. Time in any boat is the answer. And as Kent Ford says, the way to become a better boater is making hard moves on easy water. Good luck with your decision.
Really not trying 2be a smart-aleck but I'm guessing all of the mentioned boats are liable to be a bit too much... if a Zephyr was. The Zephyr is like 'Walk around in stable', compared to what's been mentioned. You might need to progress in stages, like maybe to an Ocoee, Viper, Detonator, or Spark. And then, and only then, move on.... the Cascade and Capton are entirely different modes of travel, you're attempting to make the jump from 8N-Tractor into a Sports Car... that Zoom will have you for lunch, it's extremely unstable compared to what you're use to... from Esquif's website: Radical ! The Zoom, for the advanced paddler, is the most agile, quick and responsive Royalex canoe available...and the little roto-molded canoes will make your head spin, they are that good... the Zephyr is definitely intro level - it's wide, with limited edges, and almost no rocker( compared to most whitewater canoes)... Not knocking Esquif - there are really good Esquif canoes, these are just not the ones I'd pick for you right now...D-Caption wrote:... I currently paddle the Dagger Caption and love it . I paddled a Zepher for one season and just could not get comfortable with the agressive edges ...
I do highly recommend getting something new(er), that Caption and Cascade are a couple generations behind... there are much more responsive and enjoyable boats out there these days, you'll enjoy boating all over again!!!
Mastering the short boat
Thanks Alan B and Philcanoe for responding to my post, I forgot to tell you I am 5 ft 8 in tall and weigh 175 soaking wet. I live in central Al. I have paddled LRC chair lift section but walked a couple sections, was paddeling the Zepher that day the level was 1700 way too pushy for me,the guys paddeling with me said it was like paddeling the ocoee that day. I have only paddeling seriously for about three yrs on rivers like the nanty, the tuck, coosa up to 8000 the upper Tallapoosa up to 6000 and some smaller stuff, mostly class 2 and 3. It would really be nice to borrow an Ocoee or swap boats on the river and try some different boats. I must say the Spanish Fly sure looks appealing as well as the Quake, I paddeled a Spark and it was really nice but didn<t get to keep it long enough. Philcanoe do you still paddle the SF and is it stable it would seem to be according to he specs. Would be nice to meet you on the river sometime for a short demo and someones Ocoee if possible. thanks so much for all your help D-Caption
Throwing my $.02
I quickly scanned the info and thought I might mention the Mohawk Viper. I've got three of them; the Viper 12 being the most stable. I live in B'ham and can't paddle due to knee injury...have a second surgery scheduled for next week. So, if you want to borrow one to try on the Mulberry or whatever. I use a Viper 11 and have been for many years; I tandem with the kids in the Viper 12. I've also paddled C boats, Ocoee, and some of the hybrids.
If I had unlimited funds I"d probably have a spanish fly and a couple of those canadian boats. As it is I get used and repair as needed.
If I had unlimited funds I"d probably have a spanish fly and a couple of those canadian boats. As it is I get used and repair as needed.
Your size is great for boat choices. Nothing is off the table now. As you and others have mentioned, try as many boats as you can. I also would suggest you stay out of the Caption for awhile and jump in the Zepher a few more times, in between other test paddles. It might serve as a baseline. The Caption is a great tandem boat so I would hang on to that...
The frustrating thing about trying many different boats is it can't happen on the same day and the same river. An edgy boat early in the process might feel much better a few weeks later. Your skills will evolve more quickly as you try a number of boats and all this will mess with your perception. But, it is all you can do to try and narrow the choices down. If you are dedicated to the sport for the long haul, buy a boat that will be challenging for awhile and that you can grow into. It will take some work but you won't regret it.
The frustrating thing about trying many different boats is it can't happen on the same day and the same river. An edgy boat early in the process might feel much better a few weeks later. Your skills will evolve more quickly as you try a number of boats and all this will mess with your perception. But, it is all you can do to try and narrow the choices down. If you are dedicated to the sport for the long haul, buy a boat that will be challenging for awhile and that you can grow into. It will take some work but you won't regret it.