C-Forum

I'm having the devil of a time getting my new Taureau to roll up. Whatever I was doing that worked on a Nitro or Paradigm isn't working for me here. I've identified a couple of issues:

(1) in a "traditional" open boat you can lean way out at a right angle to the boat so you get a lot of leverage, but you can't do that in a Taureau because you are locked in with your knees under the bulkhead, and

(2) when you roll a traditional canoe the beginning of the roll passes the arc of the side of the canoe (that is, travels over a curve) and the flat part (that is, the bottom) is reached once the center of gravity shifts and you're pretty much already up, but in the Taureau in order to roll you have to travel past a very hard edge.

My conclusion thus far is that only a very sharp hip snap will work, but my hip-snapping technique is not well developed.

Any tips would be appreciated.

Watch Louie in PLG's videos from Mexico this winter for "Taureau rolling tips".

get into a c1 for a while

I am really well know for my rollin.

Maybe borrow a C-boat for a while, but the best thing to do is just practice more and none of that sissy pool stuff, Breaak the ice and then flip over in the water after two of three time of swimmin you get your roll

Louie wrote:I am really well know for my rollin.

Maybe borrow a C-boat for a while, but the best thing to do is just practice more and none of that sissy pool stuff, Breaak the ice and then flip over in the water after two of three time of swimmin you get your roll

...you and Michael Phelps

For me the trick is to really concentrate on making sure I'm pushing really hard on my offside knee first at the start of the roll. I then pull with my onside knee while still pushing vigorously with my offside knee, then push my forehead down on the paddleshaft. I think in my other boats I just pulled up on my onside knee while pushing my forehead on my paddleshaft to pop up, but you're right, it seems the taureau can sometimes take a bit more to get up.
I haven't noticed not feeling like I can swing out into position though.
Make sure you are definitely facing down instead of sorta sideways. IT takes good technique

Phil that is grrreate...

I've tried to roll the taureau in pool with little success as well, it seems like I get the boat 3/4 of the way up and it just hangs. I've been practicing my roll in the gyramax as a way of building up my technique. I feel like I'm riding on top of a twitchy cork in the Taureau- unused to a the new short boats- been out of paddling last 15 years or so, boat design has changed a bit- I'm thinking it will be a warm weather, warm water, class II project for me.

i'd love to help you with this... but i really can't see what you are doing wrong from this vantage point?



care to try this? http://cboats.net/cforum/viewtopic.php?t=7959736

It's a good idea, but it requires some logistics and equipment that I'd have to organize: A real video camera, somebody to film me and a place to post it on line. I'll work on it.

The basic problem seems to be that I'm getting not enough leverage off the paddle and the hip snap doesn't move me past the tipping point.

I don't know how to tell you how to correct that....

However I heard much the same sentiments, from a group of kayaking buddies last week. They were talking about this hull being harder to roll because of it's edge, or the width of that one makes it a slower roller, and this makes a better creek boat because it rolls faster. They were discussing which edges and hull types, they prefer for what type of boating. In particular two were discussing their Karnali's saying it had softer edges, and rolled much easier than their Burns. And that displacement hulls rolled even easier. Which seemed to make a lot of sense to me.

....believe this is what you're saying?

if so maybe - just maybe - you need to alter the timing of those different components a bit... just guessing, maybe waiting a bit for the boat the get to the next step, before putting it all together... as my roll in the S'Fly is much slower than in previous boats, an almost feels like I have to make two deliberate push downs with my head... one to get up to 90, and another push to get it to turn all the way over... however I never practice rolling, unlike another buddy who rolls over a hundred times, a roll session

First, make sure that you have a hole for allowing water to switch from one side to the other, usually Taureau have these. At one point I added knee wedge to have my knees further apart and it was affecting the water flow. So I ended up removing them. A good test, stand beside your boat upside down in the water and flip it over. If it blocks on the edge, that's the problem.

Second, really concentrate on pulling your inside knee. And as opposed to big boats, this mouvement has to be quick, a quick snap.

Third, when you've done your snap and your upper body is coming up, swing the head and the shoulders to the opposite side to help following the movement.

But remember, it's all in the quick snap of the hips and if you don't get that, you won't roll it.

Gigi

Smerda and I had just agreed not to use terms like "retarded rolling" or "Moron rolling," when this thread pops up. The only politically correct term is "stupid rolling."

Well, I must say that the responses to my question do run the entire gamut of utility. Many thanks to those who tried to help.