Drying out a Taureau: Outfitting or Technique?

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Shep
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Drying out a Taureau: Outfitting or Technique?

Post by Shep »

I've been enjoying my Taureau for about six months, and I love how easily it rolls, and the fact that it's stability doesn't change all that much when swamped... But I'm not loving that a slow boat becomes a PIG when I get more than a bit of water in there. I find that I am taking on water pretty quickly when I run a few wave trains or slide-drops. When I start doing real boofs, I'm wondering if the problem is going to get even worse.

In other boats I've paddled semi-regularly (Ovation, XL-13) I just rotate the bow about 20 degrees to my line and lean upstream as I come into the wave... seems to work pretty well rejecting water. Are there techniques to do something like this with the Taureau? I'm very tempted to put a pump in it, or at least a drain plug. Have other Taureau owners done anything like this?

Thanks,
Shep
kx250guy
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Post by kx250guy »

/welcome to the hybrid canoe /deck boat world my friend. Im afraid youll find its the nature of these boats. Imagine paddling a c1 with no spray skirt and trying to keep the water out. A lot of people like them but they do have to put up with a much wetter boat than ovation's , vipers,outrages's etc, . that have been bagged out. Their advantage is quicker handling, but as you stated, this advantage is quickly lost with water enters the hull so easily.
Personally I dont like a boat that easily changes paddling characteristics half way down a rapid forcing me to go form paddling mode to survival mode. Or blowing out of a play spot or missing a crucial eddy because I filled up so easily.

If you put a skirt on that puppy ( blasphemy to some) you will be way ahead of the game I think. And you can wave at your swamped friends as the blow past the play spot , Also your boat will handle the same at the bottom of the class 4+ rapid as it did at the top. Also the number of lines available to you at any technical rapid will be much more as well.

BTW, true stories of running big falls / rapids dry etc. etc. are rare truth be known. Some posters here are unidentified factory reps and may try to tell you its your fault, or poor paddling technique yada yada, but its not really. Time and common sense will reveal it.
So I say put a skirt on this type of boat and have a ton more fun be safer to boot. Youll be less tired at the end of a long day, play more and often, youll be cutting your own path which is pretty cool too.
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Shep
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Post by Shep »

Putting a skirt on a Taureau would be like figuring out how to secure the heel of a tele binding! I'm okay if people simply say "It's the nature of the beast". My original thought was, "Does a pump make sense for this boat?", but I wanted to allow for the possibility that my impeccable paddling style might not be so impeccable. :)

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Shep
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Shep
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Post by Shep »

Oh, to be clear... I am thinking about getting a C-1 as well... just haven't decided how much of an open boat snob I am yet. My feeling is that I am happy to make my bed and sleep in it. For the time being, I am enjoying the confidence that comes from recently having developed a roll, but don't feel like I've really hit the limits of my equipment yet.
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Craig Smerda
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Post by Craig Smerda »

Shep wrote:Putting a skirt on a Taureau would be like figuring out how to secure the heel of a tele binding!

Thanks,
Shep
:roll: http://www.cboats.net/cforum/viewtopic. ... 2553#22553
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Post by Shep »

Yah, yah, I'm picking fights... :wink: I'm pretty sure you are paddling a lot scarier stuff than I am (and probably will be for a very long time). I guess it would be more fair to say that, at the moment, I am trying to figure out how far I can go and what kinds of water I can paddle with an "open" boat.

I had seen references to your modded Taureau, but never gone back to the original post. Beautiful work! These days I wonder if it would be cost effective to find a rapid prototyping shop to cut the sprayskirt from a cad model...
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Post by Mikey B »

What size flotation bags are you using? I stuffed the 48" Mohawk bags into mine, which take up all the space. I don't get enough water in it to make it that difficult to paddle...but...a pump would certainly be nice on many occasions :D
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Taureau

Post by rcgalwa »

I have a pump in mine. The boat won't hold much water even full. With a pump in it all you concerns will be taken care of, and you won't have to pull over to the side of the river to empty out. As you know a traditional bailer doesen't work well with this type of boat.
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Post by Shep »

I think I have the right bags in it... Bought it used at NOC last year, and they had new bags special ordered with it (double length fill tubes). The previous owner even had a 3-piece aquabound backup paddle that fits under the stern airbag. I am about 170, so perhaps it is just that 30lbs of water is a much bigger difference than if I were heavier. Watched the Moose river segment in This is Canoeing a week ago, and it seemed like Mark Scriver was making aggressive ferries after running big drops. Again, that might be my (lack of) technique. :)

rcgalwa, I'll be working in Newry, ME all summer. The Kennebec gorge is on my must-do list, and is part of the reason I am trying to figure this stuff out now. Ever taken your Taureau up to the Forks? Any thoughts?

Thanks,
Shep
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Post by Atucky »

When going through waves, try to get a stroke in at the bottom of the wave, while leaning back, and pulling your knees up to lift the bow. Timing is everything, but is fun when you get the hang of it. I feel like I can get the bow of my fly up almost a foot with this technique and ride over many wave, holes. It's kinda like a boof, but with the lean back part thrown in.

This helps me to stay dryin small open boats.
Last edited by Atucky on Wed May 12, 2010 12:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by rcgalwa »

Wow, there is a lot to say about what you want to do. I have done the Kennebec in my Viper 12, but I don't feel I could do it in my Taureau. Make no mistake its continuous CIV big water. When I say continuous I mean most people who swim, swim the remander of the gorge, sometimes for miles. Your concern on water in your boat is important. There are eddys to catch, but the walls of the gorge are not something you can hop out and empty your boat on. I think the hardest part is moving around in the heavy current and eddy lines and keeping your boat upright in wave trains with waves 4-8 feet high. I am not saying it can't be done, but its a good idea to know what you are getting into before you go, as hiking out isn't a realistic option. Where do you normally paddle, and what rivers have you done in your Taureau? If you want to paddle together I would be open to passing along more details of the run, and other information on local rivers if you are not local to the area. By the way you are real close to both the Rapid and Magalloway rivers in Newry. Both would be well worth more than one summer weekend.
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Post by Shep »

Part of my desire to have a truly bomb-proof roll in deep water is prepping for the gorge. There are a ton of people who work for OB up there that are single-bladers, and a few that have run the gorge. One woman has paddled it in her phantom, but the taureau would be the shortest boat to go through there in recent OB history from what I gather. (couple of people paddle ocoees as well). I definitely have the rapid and megalloway on my radar as well, and am lucky to have some other friends in the area available for paddling as well. Will be looking to paddle much between courses.

To answer the other half of your post, I've done the middle ocoee in an ovation, but not clean, before I had a roll (upper was running that day, so there were some nasty curlers at tablesaw, maybe IV- that day). Hoping to do the Dryway(IV-) on the Deerfield in western MA at the end of the month in the taureau. Always looking for more rivers to paddle to step it up. May do a 14 ft falls here in VT this week before I head over to Maine.

Thanks,
shep
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Post by philcanoe »

To me... (IMHO)

the key is not really a particular angle...

:wink:

It's more about fitting the boat to the wave period (opinion). If the space between the waves is 7 feet and your Taureau is 8 feet, then a little angle will do. If the space is 6feet, then a bit more angle... &c &c &c So if it's choppy or a few feet, then plumb sideways (or nearly), and angled opening away from the break (which ever way). If your boat is spanning or longer than the distance between waves, then water will very like come over one end.

A boof will also help, yes another bit of a difference of opinion ... :-? ... weight transfer, and proper timing really will pay off big dividends in such a boat. (no do not lean back coming off a very high drop, unless wanting to pencil in) http://cboats.net/cforum/viewtopic.php? ... sc&start=0

As said a lean - with knee lift also helps, again timing is key. And not always done at the same place, some times riding up to get open away from break. And sometimes near apex, to keep bow from diving into next (whatever) thing. Sometimes a BIG forward sweep will throw the bow across a wave top - think angled and riding near top (a bit sideways) and then throwing the bow w/a sweep to increase momentum - an help counteract break. Especially cool to couple f.sweep with that lean (sometimes).

I've always favored putting in a drain plug, but have never owned one... just a few trips, but enough to have a good feel for them. (I'll refrain from comments on the other pump idea.)

As for looking like Mark Scriver - :) good luck and work hard!
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Craig Smerda
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Post by Craig Smerda »

"pump" ? :lol:

what amazes, intrigues and drives my thought process is that some boats surprisingly still handle quite well when even full to the gunnels with water... were others become quite a handful with just a few inches of water sloshing around insode of them.

granted... as an OC'er you always want to be able to find, recognize and paddle the "clean line" but if that doesn't work out for you... it's nice to know you can still paddle your boat safely and in control and to the next logical extraction point.

we could probably start an entire thread on this MB regarding which open boats are less fun to paddle when full than tangling with a mother grizzly bear defending her cubs... but that'd be silly wouldn't it?

to me... the dry line isn't always the fun line... the safe line... and in a few instances over the years... the smart line. learning to deal with water in the boat and hopefully having a good time as an open boater is just part of the game... if you don't enjoy the game... "aids" are availible as previously mentioned.

:wink: keep working at it...
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Post by funkidreadz »

Hey Cboaters,
Here is a trick to dump water out of your canoe, thus reducing sluggishness and increasing paddling pleasure...
http://blog.jamesweir.net/2010/05/nevaf ... travo.html
Enjoy
James
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