L'EDGE QUESTION/CONCERN..(edited for content to page 2)

Decked Canoes, Open Canoes, as long as they're canoes!

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Craig Smerda
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Post by Craig Smerda »

I'm not now nor was I interested in getting getting into the middle of a public urination competition on this thread... but I can and will say this... people should buy or paddle what they want to... the more choices the merrier and "competition" is what drives the marketplace.

On the bright side of the debate from my perspective and of others... Jacques saved the SpanishFly & Prelude from the proverbial scrapyard when Pyranha decided to abandon the open canoe marketplace... so if someone still wants to paddle one of those boats they are still available *new*... and fwiw I still will paddle a SpanishFly from time to time because imo it truly is a fantastic canoe.

:lol: \/\/\/ corporate shill \/\/\/ :lol:
Last edited by Craig Smerda on Wed Sep 29, 2010 12:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
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FullGnarlzOC
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Post by FullGnarlzOC »

i think if u r good enough to where u know speed is what you are looking for and not stability. Go with a prelude...

This also depends on the amount and type of boats you have... I'd love to go with a prelude, because of its quickness, and total control for the user. But I can also be lazy, and want to 'relax' a little bit sometimes... and you cannot do that in a prelude.

I have two boats over 13ft, and 1 beat up Detonator. I'm looking for a boat that could do it all, just like the Det. I could do it all in a prelude, but I'd have to be on my toes all the time... L'dge sounds like a better overall boat, if i was going to have one.

Although... just now... I realized the progression that I would get from primarly paddling a prelude all year would be unmatched. Not to mention the possibilities with such quickness. With that being said... it also might be a great way to get beat down :o
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Post by kanur »

Fullgnarlz if we are ever at the same place I've built some (souped up, you can search the site for info) Preludes I think you would have a fullgnarlz time in :wink:
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Post by RodeoClown »

Let's face it, every boat is a compromise in one way or another, if not in several ways, but speed and instability don't inherently make a boat responsive- the example of a wildwater boat has been give. Similarly, lack of speed doesn't mean a boat isn't high performance. I'd say the Blackfly is about as high performance as they come- for what it's designed for but also about as slow as they come.

In the end, some boats are good at what they are designed for, and some fall short. Some of the good boats don't mesh with certain paddling styles, but that doesn't mean they're not good boats. From doing one run in the L'edge, I thought it was a good, forgiving river runner. I'd even go so far as to call it a bit "dumbed down" because it's so forgiving. That is in no way intended to be a negative comment. I like dumbed down a lot for river running. It's really nice to be able to focus on driving the boat where I want with a few well placed strokes. When I'm running something hard, I'd honestly rather not be thinking about the performance of the boat under me.
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FullGnarlzOC
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Post by FullGnarlzOC »

touche jeremy. there's something to be said about a boat you can just trust will stay under you as long as you don't screw up too bad. Then when ur feeling squirrelly... you can test out its capabilities.
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Post by philcanoe »

RodeoClown wrote:Let's face it, every boat is a compromise in one way or another, if not in several ways, but speed and instability don't inherently make a boat responsive- the example of a wildwater boat has been give. Similarly, lack of speed doesn't mean a boat isn't high performance. I'd say the Blackfly is about as high performance as they come- for what it's designed for but also about as slow as they come.

In the end, some boats are good at what they are designed for, and some fall short. Some of the good boats don't mesh with certain paddling styles, but that doesn't mean they're not good boats. From doing one run in the L'edge, I thought it was a good, forgiving river runner. I'd even go so far as to call it a bit "dumbed down" because it's so forgiving. That is in no way intended to be a negative comment. I like dumbed down a lot for river running. It's really nice to be able to focus on driving the boat where I want with a few well placed strokes. When I'm running something hard, I'd honestly rather not be thinking about the performance of the boat under me.
thank you!
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Craig Smerda
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Post by Craig Smerda »

Hey Jeremy... I still have version 1 in my garage if you ever want to take it for a spin... I still enjoy paddling it "up to a certain point" but it can have a bit of a mean streak on occassion when you aren't expecting it. :lol:


Phil... would you consider the Kaz's Inferno "high performance"? Maybe it would be helpful if you gave a few examples of existing boats for comparison. By all accounts... the Inferno might fit the criteria you've described.
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Post by SkeeterGuy86 »

Craig Smerda wrote:Hey Jeremy... I still have version 1 in my garage if you ever want to take it for a spin... I still enjoy paddling it "up to a certain point" but it can have a bit of a mean streak on occassion when you aren't expecting it. :lol:
version 1? whats it look like? ... the ledge looks good ... havent gotten to paddle it yet so i cant compare it to what i have paddled ... mainly being the skeeter, an ocoee, and a little bit in the blackfly ...

personally i dont know about having the stability ... i like being put on edge .... knowing that if i make a mistake that there will be consequences to that action ...

dont get me wrong ... i feel that the ocoee is a very forgiving boat and a part of me wishes that the old Royalex Ocoee was still being made (sorry but the Bell Ocoee isnt as good as the Dagger Version in my opinion) ....

some day i hope to test the ledge ... im interested in the response time ... the skeeter has great reaction time ... and the blackfly is designed to have the reaction times ....

so see you all on the water ... and Craig if you get to TN. bring that Version 1 .... i dont mind having a great swim ... i would like to test it out
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Post by oopsiflipped »

the reviews i heard on version one were, shall we say, somewhat less glowing than those for the production model.
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Craig Smerda
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Post by Craig Smerda »

ya' mean the "R&D" model Gabe? :lol:

we tried a few "things" with P1... some of them worked, some of them didn't... the production boat isn't really as far off of the original as people think though... a few lines, curves and corners were changed and massaged to go back to the "known" rather than the "unknown"

that's why you prototype :wink:
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Post by Kelvin »

Hi Folks,

Thanks for the comments, I guess as long as the L'Edge doesn't have loads more stability than a Fly and a bit more speed things will be good. I find the Prelude a stable boat (ex Zoom paddler!) but lacks the precision and tracking that I like in a hull.

Would it be fair to say that the L'Edge is not too far away from a dry Fly?

Thanks Craig and Esquif for having the balls to keep giving us new boats whilst keeping some old faithfuls alive.

I'll let you know how it paddles....

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Post by Dooleyoc-1 »

All canoes are going have tradeoffs. As I said in my initial L'Edge review, it is not a fast boat. Also, as others have said before, you should try as many boats as you can and then get the boat that you like the best. Here is my take on the speed of the short plastic boats that I have spent a lot of time in:

-The Skeeter is the fastest by far (it's the only short plastic canoe that I would call "fast")

-The Prelude is the 2nd fastest

-The L'Edge is definitely slower than the skeeter and prelude but it's also faster than the flys and quake.

-the superfly is incredibly slow (but still a great boat) and the spanish fly is slow but a hair faster than the super fly.

-I can't remember if a fly is faster than a quake. I like the quake because it's so durable and stable but it is also really slow.

The spanish fly is definitely better at playing than any of these boats, the skeeter is faster than any of these boats and the L'Edge is more stable and a lot drier than any of these boats and it's still very maneuverable. For the record, the L'Edge is my boat of choice for running anything hard or where I'm going to be pushing myself.
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Post by markzak »

I think rodeoclown said it best. To build on that...

I found that the L'edge had great control and stability coming into and out of gnarly eddy lines, big water stuff that would throw around other open boats. With that though, it lacks some of the control and responsiveness that I am used to from my Prelude. The Prelude really shoots out of an eddy into the current, while the ledge enters the current with stability but requires more aggressive paddling to get it going. The stability helps keep you stay in an active, paddling position, versus a low brace which is better for a class III-IV paddler who may lose control in these tougher spots, like an offside peel-out into 10,000 cfs. An offside peel-out at 10,000 cfs in a prelude would kick most people's butt, while in the L'edge it is more controlled. But if you have the skills to stay in control of the Prelude, it will peel-out stronger and faster and be more responsive in the process.

Yes, its an awesome boat and I'd recommend it for many paddlers, especially for the class II-class IV paddler. Your hardcore stuff is going be personal preference based on small factors that differentiate the L'edge from the Spanish Fly, Quake and Prelude. Personally I'll take the speed and aggressive performance of the Prelude, but i recognize that may not be best for someone steeping it up, who needs the stability to stay in an active position. I would also say that the L'edge is an improvement from the Spanish Fly, which I sold because I found it be to be slow, wet and "hole-bait", but man could that boat surf a big feature like a champ.

And to echo what Craig said... thank you to Esquif for this boat and for saving the Spanish Fly and Prelude. These 3 boats are THE boats on the market for the class V open boater in North America. Thank you!
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Post by 2opnboat1 »

MAXIM
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Craig Smerda
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Post by Craig Smerda »

SOLITO

:lol:
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