critique my roll?

[dsmoake]

I have finally learned a roll and wanted some advice on how I could do it better. I live in AZ where there are not a lot of open boaters. I did meet one guy who had a great roll but was against me using the back of the blade. He felt if you use the front of the blade you will be in a better position for a stroke once your up. I am unable to do it that way. I have landed around 20 rolls in my pool but it is not reliable yet. I also realize that a Maxim is not the best boat for a noobie but at the moment it is all I have and I have made friends with the little rascal.

http://youtu.be/Q4uEgMLTM9Q" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thanks for your help,
Dave

[CurlyFries]

Some people who know more than me will speak up soon, but here is what I have.


- Using the back of your paddle is fine. I know lots of people who roll this way. Using the power face is better but not necessary. It wont kill your roll if that's what your wondering.

- Let the boat go fully over and take the time to set up properly. Making sure you are square with your paddle and boat is key in my opinion.

- It looks to me like you aren't fully rotating and getting on top of and square with your paddle. You really want to rotate and sort of wind up for the roll. Really focus on pulling up your on side knee. This will create a nice snap. Try to get as much of your roll done during the snap. Use your paddle to get you back in the boat, not to roll.

- Try taking another video but from the side (90 degrees to your boat). It is easier to critique a roll with this view.

Here is a clip of my roll, I like to think its decent.

http://www.youtube.com/user/CurlyFriesO ... dyVwi3nOpk" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Bob Foote made a movie called 'the open canoe roll' I highly recommend it. I learned how roll by watching it once. And of course a TON of practice.


Somebody please correct me if I have said anything wrong.

Dave

[jakke]

I see some issues I'm still struggling with, after a long long time of practice.

- pull your canoe down when you do the setup. The offside gunnel should be as close to the water as possible. If not, you have no chance of creating momentum with your hips. No momentum to help you get upright.
- you seem to do a lot of pushing down with your hands
- it looks like you've bee a bit too early lifting your head when the last two attempts failed.

Kelvin has got a really nice article about rolling. It's not the Bob Foote technique though: http://www.sweet-skills.com/articles/rolling.html.

If you don't nail it any soon (say couple of months), it might be worth spending a couple of hours with an instructor, just for the sake of preventing yourself to get into bad habits.

But I'm no roll master, other people are probably better placed then me to give more feedback.

[ian123]

The biggest thing is that you re picking you head up too soon. Open your eyes and keep your face in the water until you can see the colour of your boat then drag your face across across your airbags.

You are also trying to muscle the boat up with your paddle. Aim to roll the boat with your legs/hips and use your paddle to sweep your upper body into the boat (after it's mostly upright).

Rolling shouldn't take a lot of strength. Don't force it. It's a technique move.

The boat doesn't have to all the way upside to roll it up right. Some boats like to sit on their sides... it's no big deal... that just makes it more of a low brace.

[Craig Smerda]

you'll need a good roll and bracing techniques for that boat.

watch Tommy roll one... http://vimeo.com/18606231" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

here's all I have that shows using a knuckles up technique... http://vimeo.com/26362295" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[iRolled]

I use the back of the blade on a low brace. And I use the power face of the paddle on a full roll.

[DougB]

Is there an advantage to the knuckles up/power face technique?

[Craig Smerda]

Is there an advantage to the knuckles up/power face technique?

imo... yes

[Bob Wiggins]

i personally feel that a powerface roll puts my shoulder into more danger. it tends to hurt a good bit more, and i am no where near as consistent, so i do the old flip the paddle, back of the blade roll. havent missed one that wasn't caused by getting ripped out of the boat since i got the ion.

[TheKrikkitWars]

I use both the Powerface and backface for rolling:

The Powerface roll is easier to set up for, faster and a little more natural;
The Backface roll forces you to realy wind your torso up when you set up, delivering maximum power from the snap;
The Back Deck roll works both ways, but doing it with the backface is much more natural, and puts the shoulder under less stress.

Once you get a reliable roll, try to develop the other styles of rolling and you'll find yourself instinctively choosing the best roll for your situation.

[avlclimber]

I have a prelude which I think can be a tricky boat to roll for similar reasons to the Maxim. When my roll is "on" it feels fluid like I'm doing everything in one fluid motion. When my roll is "off," I have to remind myself: hipsnap first, THEN low brace sweep up. I think this works because the timing is better, but primarily because it forces me to have a strong hipsnap. If you think about doing it "first," while the paddle just floats at the surface, then you have to start the motion without using the paddle. (i.e. if you can't start the roll until you hipsnap, then you can't "forget" the hipsnap.)

Also: Tommy's sweep-finish modification might help you push your weight "up and over the boat" in both flat water and in combat situations.

(I roll on the non-powerface, fwiw)

[dsmoake]

Thanks to everyone for the comments. I will work on it for a few weeks and post again if i need any more help.
Dave

[Wiggins]

The only thing that I would suggest that hasn't been said already is learn to stay in the boat longer. When you get on the river stuff will screw with your roll. Being able to hang out for 3, 4, or more roll attempts will come in handy.

Kyle

[Craig Smerda]

cue the music... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mctBMLUQdsg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[FullGnarlzOC]

Avl hit the nail on the head - it's all about being fluid in those types of boats. Any misstep - and your likely to miss the roll - especially before ones roll becomes dynamic.


As for the flipping the blade deal - A roll should be as simple as it can be. So whatever you have to do to simplify - I suggest doing it. It pays off in combat situations. I dont flip the blade because I think its a) a step thats not really needed, and b) you are asking to be injured sticking your bottom arm up at that angle - great way to seperate a shoulder in my opinion.

Dave - roll is looking pretty good - just keep hammering it out... it will come into its own soon enough. practice practice practice.