C-Forum

After reading Tommy's post on pumps it made me wonder... how many of you out there really use them? For myself, I've just got into solo canoeing very recently, and one of the first thing I've done is to build a pump system for my Raven because the guy at the store who sold me the boat strongly suggested it. It works fine, and has help me in several occasions. But the more I boat the less I really want to use it. You know, it's actually faster to empty out my canoe by jumping out and simply flipping it upside down and then lifting it over my shoulders. Voilà!... less then two minutes! It takes about 5 to 7 minutes for my batterie powered pump to fully empty my boat. And then there's the extra weight, wiring and of course batterie recharging... I'm starting to get fed up with all of that! You know, even a manual bildge pump is faster than a batterie powered one (that's if you don't want to get out of the boat)! The best paddlers out there, the Masons, Dooleys and company... they don't use pumps!

So, how many of you stopped using batterie powered pumps and why, and how many of you would never boat without one?

I put one in my Taureau, and when I was in the middle of getting punished on a class IV/V creek that I shouldn't have been on, I was really glad to have it. It was really good for me to not waste energy jumping out and emptying my boat. Actually, that's a laugh, I wasn't jumping out, I was swimming, and holding onto rocks, and letting my boat empty itself out before it got dragged into the next rapid. So, I would argue that for places where you are really, really pushing yourself, a pump has some real benefits that "style" don't negate.

And, with the Taureau, good luck finding a spot where you can stick your manual bilge pump and not feel like a contortionist.

That said, I mostly put a pump in because the Taureau is a bear to empty (I also thought about a drain plug). I also wanted less negative feedback when I went into a play hole (man that thing fills up fast!) When I flip or wash out of the hole, I just fire up the pump while I wait my turn to go again. Much better than finding a rock or shoreline to empty the boat manually.

All THAT said, I am not planning on putting a pump in the Option, at least not soon. Chalk it up to being cheap, lazy, and the Option is just WAY easier to empty. I don't have a big setup, and I don't use it to blast straight away through huge waves with no penalty. I still try to get the dry lines, but when it doesn't work out, it's less of a headache. In the end, I just don't think it's a big deal either way.

Shep

Shep wrote:I put one in my Taureau, and when I was in the middle of getting punished on a class IV/V creek that I shouldn't have been on, I was really glad to have it. It was really good for me to not waste energy jumping out and emptying my boat. Actually, that's a laugh, I wasn't jumping out, I was swimming, and holding onto rocks, and letting my boat empty itself out before it got dragged into the next rapid. So, I would argue that for places where you are really, really pushing yourself, a pump has some real benefits that "style" don't negate.

And, with the Taureau, good luck finding a spot where you can stick your manual bilge pump and not feel like a contortionist.

That said, I mostly put a pump in because the Taureau is a bear to empty (I also thought about a drain plug). I also wanted less negative feedback when I went into a play hole (man that thing fills up fast!) When I flip or wash out of the hole, I just fire up the pump while I wait my turn to go again. Much better than finding a rock or shoreline to empty the boat manually.

All THAT said, I am not planning on putting a pump in the Option, at least not soon. Chalk it up to being cheap, lazy, and the Option is just WAY easier to empty. I don't have a big setup, and I don't use it to blast straight away through huge waves with no penalty. I still try to get the dry lines, but when it doesn't work out, it's less of a headache. In the end, I just don't think it's a big deal either way.

Shep

You're absolutely right about the Taureau... really hard to empty that little bugger! But I still find the Taureau pretty manageable even half full; for me anyways... Have fun in your new Option!

I like pumps - I don't have one in my current boat and didn't use one last season, but I'll probably go back to using one eventually.

The rivers and creeks in Colorado are very continuous, so it's not always easy to find a good eddy to dump or bail. There have been many times where I've ended up in the only avaialbe micro eddy, unable to dump, wondering "how am I going to run the rest of this rapid with all this water in my boat - if only I had a pump". It's nice just to turn the pump on in the middle of a long rapid and let it do it's thing while you concentrate on the river.

I've been paddling a decked ledge lately and it's a vast improvement w.r.t. dryness over the prelude and phantom been paddling previously. I could easily go without using a pump in this boat. That said, I will probably put one in anyway because: 1 - I'm lazy and 2- most of the guys I paddle with are wearing skirts these days and paddle downstream much faster.

My preference is to get out and dump when my boat is more than one quarter full. Less than that and I just use a hand pump. I brace the pump against the side of the canoe with my leg and foot and can pump one handed while drifting and controlling my boat with the paddle and other hand. I have had times when I wished I had an electric pump. Twice I've run this one rapid and had to hang onto a rock in a tiny eddy halfway through while I pumped out my entire boat one handed to run the next section. That really bites, but most of the time I can find some bit of shore or exposed rock to hop out and dump and get on my way. Provides a nice chance to stretch and video my fellow boaters.

One of the things I forgot about is the difference in bulkhead vs. straps. Dealing with straps would always weigh in on my decision to get out and dump in a microeddy. With the full bulkhead in the ledge, it's not as big of a deal to hop in and out. +1 for no pump.

klund wrote:One of the things I forgot about is the difference in bulkhead vs. straps. Dealing with straps would always weigh in on my decision to get out and dump in a microeddy. With the full bulkhead in the ledge, it's not as big of a deal to hop in and out. +1 for no pump.

You're right about the bulkhead thing! That's how my Raven's set up, maybe that's why I rather just jump out and empty. It's a lot faster than with straps.

yup pump. 15' of old school long boat with lots of cockpit to fill. i find i can run with the crowd instead of going the manual route and falling behind. i find it funny that in those high tech little creek boats most of you all run that a pump would bastardize it? so if i go without a pump should i be using my 18' jensen cedar stripper?

in a tandem boat... yes!

I have pumps in both of my Open Canoes, though due to ongoing issues securing a suitable battery at a reasonable price they're unreliable to the point of near uselessness now.

I can honestly say installing one in my Prelude was a waste of time and money, I'm generally pretty cautious about biting off more than I can chew and doubly so in an open boat so it's pretty rare for me to find myself getting swamped.

On the other hand, Having one in the CU-Fly was handy (if I can get the batteies I need I'd be tempted to put both pumps into it) because there's nothing worse than rolling up after a missed move to find it's nigh impossble to make it back to the feature in your newly swamped boat, which is particularly a problem on artficial courses/weirs where there are no rocks or sloped banks to allow you to dump water from in the boat.

Anyone who objects to someone else using a pump (other than when It breaks the rules of a competiton) needs to "Sort your [Expletive!] life out".*

*I was given that very advice by a senior raft guide during my second year of Uni, shortly afterwords I stopped raft guiding and took a cleaning job with contracted hours... Best Advice Ever.

I find I like em more on big water and play spots.

When I don't want to run a dry line to blast thru some wave trains the pump is nice in class III-IV. I use the pump when paddling with kayakers so I don't have to stop as much. It was really nice today paddling French Broad at 2400 cfs and rising when I went thru S turn then boofed over a rock into a hole and filled up the L'Edge above PIllow Rapid that was pumping. Very glad to have the pump today.

When you are older you might not be so agile as to be able to quickly hop out of the boat, empty it, and hop back in, especially if you have to do so repeatedly.

And if you are having to repeatedly empty the boat, it is easy to become tired. You then start running all the cheat routes (and missing part of the fun) because you are too dam tired to empty the boat.

The point about paddling with decked boaters is well-taken. With a pump you can just hit the switch and keep going. You don't have to find an eddy to dump the boat.

And it is partly a safety issue. If you take on water when the river is high and maybe up in the trees and there aren't any eddies, or you get partially swamped at the top of a long rapid, you can hit the switch and keep on paddling.

pblanc wrote:When you are older you might not be so agile as to be able to quickly hop out of the boat, empty it, and hop back in, especially if you have to do so repeatedly.

And if you are having to repeatedly empty the boat, it is easy to become tired. You then start running all the cheat routes (and missing part of the fun) because you are too dam tired to empty the boat.

The point about paddling with decked boaters is well-taken. With a pump you can just hit the switch and keep going. You don't have to find an eddy to dump the boat.

And it is partly a safety issue. If you take on water when the river is high and maybe up in the trees and there aren't any eddies, or you get partially swamped at the top of a long rapid, you can hit the switch and keep on paddling.

... or you can get in a decked boat and not worry about any of the above, right?

I like having the pump for running big water, as well as for dumping the boat without stopping, so that I don't slow down the group. I like not having the pump cuz it forces me to run drier and focus on my lines better