C-Forum

Hi there,
Got a Taureau with no warranty left which has got a crack in his hull on the side. Tried to repair it with PP welding but didn´t work.
Wrote 2 emails to Esquif about this, asked about help, didn´t get any answer (this was 4 weeks ago!)
Even offered to pay for sending me a piece of T-form elite.
Can anyone help in suggesting what material to use for welding?
Does anyone have the same experience with such a weak customer service at Esquif´s?
I am very disappointed about not even getting a reply.

Looking foward to suggestions,
Roger

Sorry bro. They don't really weld and nothing really sticks to them. It might make a good kids boat or something.

Re: Esquif- you might have luck contacting your rep instead of the company directly.

That sucks.

Maybe try using the phone instead of email. The Esquif website has their numbers listed for offices and reps.

My experience with Esquif customer service was positive. Email is fickle. Maybe they got caught in a filter.

Why would they not weld? Is the plastic crosslink?

A fix as described by West G-flex might work, if backed by inside cloth, resin or mastic.

Then there's the duct tape welding method, though I don't know if it would work on a larger split or tear.

One more thought. Did you buy your Tareau new? If so, talk with your dealer. They may have a better idea of who to contact at Esquif. One of the mistakes I apparently made when my L'Edge broke was calling Esquif directly instead of talking to the store where I bought the boat.

You may want to further investigate welding - I know of one Taureau that was successfully welded. It's unfortunate especially because that hull isn't being made anymore. I doubt you could have got a replacement anyway.

I believe the material is polypropylene based. Most adhesives, including methacrylates, urethanes, and epoxies (including G Flex epoxy) won't bond durably to polypro unfortunately.

My understanding is that polypropylene is, at least in theory, thermal weldable. It may be that Esquif has done something to this proprietary material that turns it into a thermoset rather than a thermoplastic material.

There are some adhesives that will bond to polypro. These all appear to be "rubber" or acrylic based adhesives. What I have read is that one of the best is 3M DP8005 but it is very pricey and requires an additional mixing nozzle, and even pricier applicator to use. The three together will set you back well over $100:

http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/e ... 593&rt=rud" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I have read that some have used this adhesive to bond anchors to Twin-tex boats, which also have a polypropylene matrix. I have not used it.

I have also sent emails to Esquif that have gone unanswered. I know quite a few folks who have attempted to contact Esquif, or Esquif representatives without success. Some have eventually gotten through after many attempts and some haven't. Last year I was told by an employee of a very, very well known Esquif dealer in the Southeast that they often had trouble communicating with Esquif. I agree it is unfortunate.

Good education on repairs, thanks.

As to an Esquif warranty I had an early Esquif production Detonator issue that left a bad taste and put me off their product for years. Basically we couldn't even get to disagreeing. Total ignore. It seemed then to be company policy.
Later an issue with a Mohawk was cleared up in one quick phone call and the workable compromise on both our parts was good.

Esquif makes very interesting products and pushes the envelope in design that changes canoeing for the better. I'm glad they are in the market.
I don't buy thier early product runs though. Other paddlers experiences are my warranty.

The taureau is based on "T-form elite", a polypropylene blend. Question is, which kind of blend is it?
Polypropylene-abs?

If you need filler plastic just cut it from the cockpit rim or similar.

I have heard of them being welded fine before.

From my understanding, it is tricky to weld because the burning temperature is close to the melting temperature. If it oxidizes the weld won't be strong. Try hot air welding it normally while using a shielding gas. If you know someone with a good metal welding setup they should have something you can use.

Dave

Thank you for your replies!
Since Esquif didnt replied to my questions I did cut a piece of the cockpit rim. Not really one of my prefered solutions...
The crack is water-proof now, but I dont know whether it will be rugged enough under normal mechanical load
For better bonding I used a stainless steel wire every 2 inches to connect both edges of the crack.

Good luck.

It does feel pretty weird at first to cut off one part of a boat to fix another part. I've had to hack off welding rods from the cockpit of my Remix several times. You get used to it.

we taped the nose of one that cracked pretty badly with vynal mastic. Seem to stick to the material just fine.

welding would be better if you can figure it out. try to find Eli Helbert, and ask him his thoughts on the subject.

"I believe the material is polypropylene based"
Nop. Taureau made from polyethylene. Twintex is based on polypropylene. ( OC-1 Zephyr)

bummer for sure. Esquif has been notorious for putting product on the market before
getting their product material homework done, although the reps i met have been great.
This has left some of their customers out to dry.