C-Forum

I'm not looking for a paddle recommendation for myself. (FYI I've been using Mitchell paddles for years and really like them.) My wife and I paddle with a university club that has its own canoe and kayak gear. Currently the club has Mohawk canoe paddles that, at least in my opinion, are durable but blade heavy and not a very good paddle.

Something like a Mitchell paddle would cost too much for the club to buy. Also, the club has a wide range of paddling abilities, often having people new to whitewater paddling. Does anyone have any suggestions for a decent, whitewater canoe paddle - one whose price doesn't break the bank?

I know that Werner makes canoe paddles and that Norse is making canoe paddles again. I haven't used Norse paddles for many years and haven't had Werner paddles before.

Also, durability would be a plus as Wisconsin whitewater rivers are often boulder-strewn.

Thanks - John

Werner paddles are light and have a nice feel but their blades wear out quickly. If I were purchasing paddles for beginners on white water I would go for AquaBound. They are tough and cheap. Admittedly they don"t have the same feel as a top of the line stick but they get the job done.

I don't think you can beat Mohawk for your use. Carlisle is tougher but heavier and a less smooth blade shape, although I think NOC still uses Carlisle in classes.

I know neither feels good to an experienced paddler, but for a university club that does not really matter a lot.

I recommend the Norse "Millbrook". Available from Norse or Millbrook Boats.

The Norse is an absolute bombproof tank of a paddle... and doubles as an axe - but great paddles.

The carlisle is a step up from the mohawk and is very tough and forgiving for beginners - The blade is more rigid
than the mohawk, even though it doesn't feather as well...

I'll second the Norse recommendation. I've used a "lighter duty" Norse prototype on and off for a few years and think it far superior to a Carlisle (the go to raft guest stick around here). I also have an original Norse guide stick, which is the battle ax everyone claims it is and great for a 16-20' raft. The lighter duty one is far more pleasurable to use (and less tiring to actually paddle with). Mine doesn't have the finesse of a more expensive paddle, but won't have the price either.

I've not used the "Millbrook", but I'd definitely try it out if the price point fits the budget.

Werner's are probably not the best to start out with (expensive) but I find mine wears pretty well on west coast gravel bars and boulder gardens. My carbon Bandit works well although I would prefer a blade that has a little more flex. I still list the Werner in my top three: Waterstick, which was super light and swam thru the water... but broke, and my Lightning (Guide?), which had a bit of everything: light enough, flex and strength. I wore the Lighting down to spoon size and still keep it hanging on the rack for sentimentality.

I painted one blade side black, kept the other yellow, for instruction and demonstration purposes of where is the "power face"? I used a shorter Lightining C-1 blade for a while but found it stiff.

What do I look for in a favourite blade?
Lightness counts for me, not because of the lesser mass weight to move around but because a light blade is more reactive to the subtle changes in water flow.
Flex counts. A feeling that the blade is loading up and unloading, that it is not just a shovel for moving water or canoes.
Strength. Occasionally I power up, and the blade will hit a rock in the glacial silt or spring runoff and it will come to a dead stop. Pretty harsh on the shaft, worse on my nose as the T grip comes out of the grip hand and hits me in the nose. A fair comment would be I'm over cranking and I have adjusted, but it still happens, occasionally. Bad words follow.

I get fairly attached to a "favoured" blade, sometimes maybe even more than to a canoe design.
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I've heard paddles compared to tires - Why buy a nice car and put cheap tires on it? But... This was about beginner sticks. You don't put Pirelli on you're first car.

sbroam wrote:I've heard paddles compared to tires - Why buy a nice car and put cheap tires on it? But... This was about beginner sticks. You don't put Pirelli on you're first car.

I agree.

I have loads of experience with kayak paddles but relatively little with canoe/C1 paddles, and almost none of the brands discussed are really available here, so it would be kind of useful if someone could actually describe the attributes that make a good paddle for different purposes.

At present my main paddle is an Endless River Phantom - ER are a UK brand (I don't think they make the paddles themselves) so most won't be familiar with it, basically it is a solid carbon, flat blade, quite wide, fairly long. The blade is quite thick so overall it is fairly heavy, but it does have a fair bit of power due to the size. I have been getting on quite well with it in the Ocoee but sometimes it is real heavy going, especially in a slalom C1. I suspect what it is lacking is any shaft flex, which in my experience with kayak paddles tends to ease the load at the start of the stroke, and provide an extra kick at the end - in the water this thing tends to stay put pretty well, but it doesn't seem to be easy to pull the boat past it.

I am therefore looking for carbon paddle, this time with a curved blade since I am past reverting to knifing J and indian stroke in my OC1 or C1, but what kind of blade area, blade width, tip shape, dihedral, rib on blade or smooth face, carbon shaft carbon/glass shaft, carbon/kevlar shaft etc. etc. Do I want the flex in the shaft, or the blade or both? In kayak I like the flex of the (formerly Lendal) G1F shaft which I think is 80% carbon 20% glass, but obviously a canoe shaft is shorter overall but my grip width is wider, so if I wanted the same amount of flex do I need a more flexible shaft, or less flexible, and do I even want similar flex characteristics, or does the flex profile need to be totally different?

Will the same paddle work for me in OC1 (Ocoee), C1 playboat (Session+, if I take to it) and Slalom C1 or should I be looking for 2 or 3 different paddles?

(of course my questions are vastly different to the OPs question, for him I would say start with C100s with fibreglass shaft (cheap and serviceable) and see how you go, but I don't even know if you get Ainsworth paddles? )

Cheers!

Jim

aqua-bound edge very powerful yet forgiving when striking a rock.

JimW wrote:

sbroam wrote: Will the same paddle work for me in OC1 (Ocoee), C1 playboat (Session+, if I take to it) and Slalom C1 or should I be looking for 2 or 3 different paddles?

(of course my questions are vastly different to the OPs question, for him I would say start with C100s with fibreglass shaft (cheap and serviceable) and see how you go, but I don't even know if you get Ainsworth paddles? )

Cheers!

Jim

I use a Mitchell Premier Carbon (blade) in C1 and OC1 - I now use a wood shaft instead of Carbon shaft because the wood flexes more and causes less issues for my shoulders...

I don't know that a beginner will have the control or the feel to know the difference between a carlisle and a better paddle and you really cant beat them for $20 for the economy version...

JimW wrote: Will the same paddle work for me in OC1 (Ocoee), C1 playboat (Session+, if I take to it) and Slalom C1 or should I be looking for 2 or 3 different paddles?

(of course my questions are vastly different to the OPs question, for him I would say start with C100s with fibreglass shaft (cheap and serviceable) and see how you go, but I don't even know if you get Ainsworth paddles? )

Cheers!

Jim

You might consider a Galasport paddle. There are several models and layups to choose from. I've been using them for about 5 years and they've stood up to my moderate-cruising and slalom use.

The Norse "Millbrook" is the same weight as an all carbon paddle, and it's a LOT more durable.

Bob P wrote:

JimW wrote: Will the same paddle work for me in OC1 (Ocoee), C1 playboat (Session+, if I take to it) and Slalom C1 or should I be looking for 2 or 3 different paddles?

(of course my questions are vastly different to the OPs question, for him I would say start with C100s with fibreglass shaft (cheap and serviceable) and see how you go, but I don't even know if you get Ainsworth paddles? )

Cheers!

Jim

You might consider a Galasport paddle. There are several models and layups to choose from. I've been using them for about 5 years and they've stood up to my moderate-cruising and slalom use.

Cheers Bob - I have already failed to make head or tail of the different options Galasport offer Their website includes very scant details about the blades (or shafts), I guess I'll just have to borrow some paddles and see which ones I like.

Jim

Cheers Bob - I have already failed to make head or tail of the different options Galasport offer Their website includes very scant details about the blades (or shafts), I guess I'll just have to borrow some paddles and see which ones I like.

FWIW, I'm using the 3M Midi Carbon/Kevlar blade/shaft. A little flex built in.