Outfitting advice for an old Rival?

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Outfitting advice for an old Rival?

Post by kona »

Outfitting advice for an old Rival?

Not too many OC1s available around the Twin Cities, but I did just pick up my first dedicated WW boat, a '95 dagger rival in r-lite. I hope it will be suitable for an ambitious beginner. The poorly placed Mike Yee outfitting was coming up so I pulled it. A picture from before I pulled the old vinyl patches: https://flic.kr/p/TWAnxb

I need to spend some time cleaning up the mess but also have to decide what to do going forward. A large and 11-12" high saddle is left, along with the Mike Yee crotch anchor below the saddle that seems solid enough. The shelf at the back of the saddle is currently ~82" back from the tip of the bow, which isn't too far off from the 83" distance reportedly advised by Foote http://sporttoday.org/28_17496482fc3f2cc3_1.htm

I'd very much appreciate any input. Unsure how long I'll stick with this boat and how well 22-year old r-lite will hold up, I've been contemplating two options:

Cheapest (and easiest?) option might be to install a Mohawk thigh retainer and try to carve the saddle to approximate the one sold by Mohawk, with the hard angle/forward stop for the thigh retainer? This option appeals to me as it saves some dough and might be the least hassle with installation only of two vinyl patches and new knee pads?

Alternatively, I am intrigued by the bulkhead foam saddle, though I'm not sure how well it would fit the boat.. I sat in one in an old dagger phantom and was impressed. I wonder if that would be a good option for an old Rival. Does that get glued down along the wings above the thighs and the bottom, or just the bottom, or neither? I see that blackfly offers theirs, and also found an interesting looking one here: http://canotslegare.com/produit/selle-f ... ree-water/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Once installed, is that it, or might it be salvaged and moved to a different boat later?

Any other thoughts or opinions on the merits of outfitting an old rival? It is a worthy endeavor, right?

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Re: Outfitting advice for an old Rival?

Post by arhdc »

Hi Dan,

I just looked at your photos and read your story, good stuff. Your Rival should be a good boat to get started, I would say it's worth the effort to fix. I'll see what I can do to address your questions.

I love bulkhead saddles, I truly do, they are my favorite. Having said that, if I had a r-lite Rival I would not put a bulkhead in it. It's a nice lite and fast boat that doesn't need a 15lbs saddle weighing it down. I have used a few mohawk thigh belt setups and they are ok but I much prefer a nicely set up thigh strap setup. It's light, easily adjustable and frankly you already have most of the components. For plastic creek boats, go bulkhead every time, but this is not a rock bashing creek boat, or it won't be for long if that is how you use it. That 12" saddle should be more like 7-10 inches high and I would just install anchors to use the thigh straps it came with. If you decide you are dead set on a bulkhead, being mindful that it'll cost a fair fraction of that of a new boat, then Matt Todhunter is the guy to contact https://www.facebook.com/ridgespirit/. Matt can make you a saddle this is fitted to the dimensions of your boat. Matt is a great guy and makes great saddles.

Just being willing to try is half the battle.
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Good score

Post by Einar »

Good score for a first ww canoe. I would define it as a "transition boat", a good enough hull that as a newbie you are going to pound to pieces without crying over your $.
New paddlers in too $ hulls struggle to develop, spending too much time and effort concerned about their investment.

Your rigging looks 'good enough' to get on the water and paddle, paddle, paddle.
By the way my seat height is 7.5 inches, a personal flavour. I would just start carving the seat down till the pain meets the fun, that is more stable, less top heavy-tippy.

As to royalite, my first ww hull was a Mohawk Viper 11 in royalite and within a year it looked like it had acne. I ended up selling it for the the cost of the rigging. Fun, light to paddle but it didn't survive a new paddler.
Good luck. Paddle hard in the spring, rerig or shop in the winter.
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Not misplacing all your crap in somebody else's car seems to be even harder
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Re: Outfitting advice for an old Rival?

Post by kona »

Thanks for the input. I posted a few more photos of the boat including the bottom and more recent progress. The hull is not soft anywhere, and barely has any of the color layer showing through. The previous owner said he swam a lot on the few runs he made before putting it in the rafters for a decade. Based on the saddle height and poor placement of the strap anchors, I'm not too surprised. Decent shape for 22 years old.

I won't worry too much about it, but I do like the idea of keeping the investment low for now, along with the weight. Hopefully I can get the old floatation back into service.

I've pulled the old stuff out and will start carving on the saddle in a day or two. From there I guess thigh and knee anchors make the most sense.
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Re: Outfitting advice for an old Rival?

Post by Paddle Power »

I love the Rival. It is friendly and fast. It also makes a great solo whitewater canoe tripping boat.

I'd go with thigh straps or a bulkhead. You already have thigh straps and anchors so might be your best option.

Before you cut down your saddle you should try out some other solo canoes to see what saddle height you like.

Your Rival hull looks in excellent shape for its age.
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