From Jan Dettmer review of Prodigy X :
"If you get the bow out of the water with a good boof stroke just above the hole, it can also run holes dry. Since it does not have much flare in the bow, a good boofstroke is important. "
What is a good boof stroke? How and when should I use it?
Thanks
JonMc
Boof Stroke?
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Jan_dettmer
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that is hilarious Alden!!
Jon, you can also read this article:
http://www.chrisj.winisp.net/articles/boofing.htm
it is for Kayakers but ver good (I think).
The bigger the boat, the harder it gets to boof.
Cheers, Jan
Jon, you can also read this article:
http://www.chrisj.winisp.net/articles/boofing.htm
it is for Kayakers but ver good (I think).
The bigger the boat, the harder it gets to boof.
Cheers, Jan
Is there something like an expert kayaker?
http://www.bc-ww.com
http://www.bc-ww.com
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willlyons(drunk)
A good boof stroke is very important. A boof stroke is usually a powerful foward stroke taken at the lip of a vertical drop (or near vertical) used to lift the bow. It's similar to a wheelie drop on a bicycle. The key is to use whatever features are available at the lip, be it a rock just under the surface of the water or a wave, or just a straight lip of a waterfall. Each type of 'boof' reacts differently. If you intend on doing any creekboating, a good boof is necessary, onside and off...good luck boofing that open boat....
Will
Will
boatin
hey will,
so is this the kind of stroke you are going to use at the top of "Big Boy?" What creeks have you been running, rumor has it, the Toxaway?? Do tell us about Wintergreen falls!! I imagine you'dhave to really step up to the plate on that or raven's fork if you were in c-1. you ever boat with a c-1er named erik amason down there??
Alden
so is this the kind of stroke you are going to use at the top of "Big Boy?" What creeks have you been running, rumor has it, the Toxaway?? Do tell us about Wintergreen falls!! I imagine you'dhave to really step up to the plate on that or raven's fork if you were in c-1. you ever boat with a c-1er named erik amason down there??
Alden
Follow up...
Hey Alden that's the dam / drop on Jacbos Creek - 5 minutes from my cabin. That was at really low water but makes us laugh when we think about it! Not a good landing!!!
Check out this photo of the creek to see other things that need to be avoided when padding this - http://www.americanwhitewater.org/photos/?photoid=7436 - this is not boofable! The sad part is that there are parts of the trailier still in the creek as parts of a bad boy strainer (in a section now named roadway).
Will - I like the guest sign on - gives us a frame of reference. The note as to Onside and OFF - is key (and one of my weaknesses). PS - I still have the xxx - slightly modified and loving it. No "true" squirt boat yet.
I too would like to hear what your "dropping" now? Maybe you can get a picture of a boof to post here!
JonMc - As for the Boof - think of it as "ski jumping" in your boat over something you really, really don't want to visit! Power paddle forward toward drop, at the drop use a very strong power stroke forward (pull) with a lean back going over the lip (or item boofing) - this is keep the nose from dropping (penciling) on you - don't forget to pry to adjust for landing. Then get ready to get forward at landing to paddle hard so you get the heck out of the landing zone.
If that makes sense to you!
Check out this photo of the creek to see other things that need to be avoided when padding this - http://www.americanwhitewater.org/photos/?photoid=7436 - this is not boofable! The sad part is that there are parts of the trailier still in the creek as parts of a bad boy strainer (in a section now named roadway).
Will - I like the guest sign on - gives us a frame of reference. The note as to Onside and OFF - is key (and one of my weaknesses). PS - I still have the xxx - slightly modified and loving it. No "true" squirt boat yet.
I too would like to hear what your "dropping" now? Maybe you can get a picture of a boof to post here!
JonMc - As for the Boof - think of it as "ski jumping" in your boat over something you really, really don't want to visit! Power paddle forward toward drop, at the drop use a very strong power stroke forward (pull) with a lean back going over the lip (or item boofing) - this is keep the nose from dropping (penciling) on you - don't forget to pry to adjust for landing. Then get ready to get forward at landing to paddle hard so you get the heck out of the landing zone.
If that makes sense to you!
Paul C.
Cboats Moderator
Official TOG Member (Team Old Guy)!
Cboats Moderator
Official TOG Member (Team Old Guy)!
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marcel proust
boatin
oh my lord, that is terrible, paul. looks like that guy tried to boof his truck over the creek, but wound up paying a visit. That happened at the Ocoee once . . .
http://www.americanwhitewater.org/photos/?photoid=3334
As for boofing, anyone ever seen that kayak movie, Valhalla, where Seth Warren pitons off a falls and breaks his feet? They ask him later what he plans to do and he says, "Learn how to boof." Fortunately c-1ers don't have to worry about their feet.
Alden
http://www.americanwhitewater.org/photos/?photoid=3334
As for boofing, anyone ever seen that kayak movie, Valhalla, where Seth Warren pitons off a falls and breaks his feet? They ask him later what he plans to do and he says, "Learn how to boof." Fortunately c-1ers don't have to worry about their feet.
Alden
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Craig Smerda
- L'Edge Designer
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- Location: WaUSAu Wisconsin USA North America Earth, etc.
The boof stroke is best taken at the last possible moment as you are going over a drop. Essentially it should propel you much further from the natural landing position than if you just plunged over the drop without taking that last stroke keeping your bow higher so you land flatter. That's when you here the "BOOF" noise made by your hull landing nearly flat.
On shallow creeks a method I was taught is to take your stroke "using" either the lip or a rock to grab onto and pull your stroke from. You can really launch and if the water level is marginal you won't get hung up on whatever it is you are paddling over or get twisted sideways by smaller holes taking you off your line. A beefy-strong paddle is recommended here folks (thanks Bailey!) or you will reap havoc on the blade.
Yes Will(sober)... you can launch an OC with a boof. I launched so hard last time at Wonder Falls on the Big Sandy that I landed completely flat... and I felt it for a day or so. Pancake landings on big drops hurt... melt 'em down.
Craig
On shallow creeks a method I was taught is to take your stroke "using" either the lip or a rock to grab onto and pull your stroke from. You can really launch and if the water level is marginal you won't get hung up on whatever it is you are paddling over or get twisted sideways by smaller holes taking you off your line. A beefy-strong paddle is recommended here folks (thanks Bailey!) or you will reap havoc on the blade.
Yes Will(sober)... you can launch an OC with a boof. I launched so hard last time at Wonder Falls on the Big Sandy that I landed completely flat... and I felt it for a day or so. Pancake landings on big drops hurt... melt 'em down.
Craig
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pac as a guestee
ohhhh.....
Will
That hurts just looking at it!
Hopefully that was no one you know! How was the recovery?
Alden
From the looks of things that driver's boof was bad - missing his landing (road) and the river (lucky of the boaters). It sucks having to dodge a trailer carcass and contents when boating. Jacobs still has the Roadway trailer rear door forming a bad a$$ strainers as of this weekend.
Laughed at the dam again! 
Jon
Did this help any!
That hurts just looking at it!
Hopefully that was no one you know! How was the recovery? Alden
From the looks of things that driver's boof was bad - missing his landing (road) and the river (lucky of the boaters). It sucks having to dodge a trailer carcass and contents when boating. Jacobs still has the Roadway trailer rear door forming a bad a$$ strainers as of this weekend.
Laughed at the dam again! Jon
Did this help any!
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JonMc
Thanks
Thanks all for the info and the links. It appears to be an extension (significant) to what I've figured out for going through short steep standing waves. Lean back to lighten the bow and put a stroke in on the face to go up and over. Looking back, there have been a couple of places I've had difficulties (AKA a swim) where a boof stroke would have put me over and through instead of just dropping in for a brief and unpleasant visit.
Thanks again.
Jon
Thanks again.
Jon
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Jan_dettmer
- CBoats Addict
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Yeah, don't lean back. Never ever
In river running leaning back is bad, always be agressive.
When I learned how to boof, I wrote this into my little book:
- paddle towards lip faster than the water
- lean agressively forward and time the last stroke so you
grab the water at the lip (might mean to place paddle against rock
or smashing it into the curtain)
- kick your hips forward while doing the body rotation of the stroke
still lean forward
- crunch knees towards chest
- If drop is big, turn head sideways
- Boof stroke always turns the boat, calculate that into angle of
approach
- Upon landing, instantly reach beyond boil line and pull boat out
of feature
- keep shaft very vertical to minimize turn momentum if not
desired (most cases)
- can also try to reach under the boat in tight stuff
- land totally flat edge to edge and do not brace, do forward
stroke instead
...I am still learning. Man some boofs can be pretty hard to get,
especially when you are on a ramp or something not as defined
as a nice curtain type fall.
Will, did theat guy pin himself? That looks like a sweet drop, super
nice bedrock. Where is that?
Cheers, Jan
In river running leaning back is bad, always be agressive.
When I learned how to boof, I wrote this into my little book:
- paddle towards lip faster than the water
- lean agressively forward and time the last stroke so you
grab the water at the lip (might mean to place paddle against rock
or smashing it into the curtain)
- kick your hips forward while doing the body rotation of the stroke
still lean forward
- crunch knees towards chest
- If drop is big, turn head sideways
- Boof stroke always turns the boat, calculate that into angle of
approach
- Upon landing, instantly reach beyond boil line and pull boat out
of feature
- keep shaft very vertical to minimize turn momentum if not
desired (most cases)
- can also try to reach under the boat in tight stuff
- land totally flat edge to edge and do not brace, do forward
stroke instead
...I am still learning. Man some boofs can be pretty hard to get,
especially when you are on a ramp or something not as defined
as a nice curtain type fall.
Will, did theat guy pin himself? That looks like a sweet drop, super
nice bedrock. Where is that?
Cheers, Jan
Is there something like an expert kayaker?
http://www.bc-ww.com
http://www.bc-ww.com
-
Larry Horne
- C Maven
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- Location: Northern California
good advice jan,
i have that habit of leaning back on the last stroke and i tend to land off balance because of it. i think it comes from my open boating background.
it sucks to ruin a great boof by falling over on the landing.
i need some RAIN!!.. so i can practice.. so when you and alden come to cali in May...
i have that habit of leaning back on the last stroke and i tend to land off balance because of it. i think it comes from my open boating background.
it sucks to ruin a great boof by falling over on the landing.
i need some RAIN!!.. so i can practice.. so when you and alden come to cali in May...
Larry
knees do the opposite of your body
another thing to note about boof strokes... or anything else you do in a boat for that matter...
the lower body has a strong tendency to counteract any movement you do with your upper body. Give it a try... if you lean back, you are pushing your knees downward. In big ol' tandem boats, it's a common thing to see the paddlers leaning back to avoid shipping water on bigger drops.. but if you're at the pivot point of the boat (ie, the centre), leaning back will force the bow of the boat downwards, ruining any boof attempt (and throwing you off balance as Larry noted)...
I find this a useful exercise with beginners when they are just learning the roll... when you lift your head out of the water, not only is the weight of your noggin pulling downwards, but you are also doing a reverse knee drive, pulling the boat further upside down on top of you.
something to think about...
cheers,
-allan
the lower body has a strong tendency to counteract any movement you do with your upper body. Give it a try... if you lean back, you are pushing your knees downward. In big ol' tandem boats, it's a common thing to see the paddlers leaning back to avoid shipping water on bigger drops.. but if you're at the pivot point of the boat (ie, the centre), leaning back will force the bow of the boat downwards, ruining any boof attempt (and throwing you off balance as Larry noted)...
I find this a useful exercise with beginners when they are just learning the roll... when you lift your head out of the water, not only is the weight of your noggin pulling downwards, but you are also doing a reverse knee drive, pulling the boat further upside down on top of you.
something to think about...
cheers,
-allan