I'd agree with Heidi on the difficulty of the river comparison.
I will point out again, however, that the consequences are higher. Due to the remoteness of the Hudson it's a longer distance to get off the river.
I've seen the Kennebec at "normal" flows, and the Dead at a higher water release. Both were a lot of fun, but required less maneuvering than the Hudson (more rocks...A LOT more rocks...at this level.). Yes, the Kennebec has BIG waves, and at this level the Hudson will top out at 5-6' in the Narrows, but (at least in a C1) I never worried about the waves much. Just Magic and Maytag. And I almost surfed Magic one time (eddied out river left). In a sense the rocks make it easier, as you have plenty of eddy's that are fairly easy to get in to to take a break. There are also flatish stretches to rest on. But it's a long trip. And a lot of fun:)
If you're up for an all-day paddle of this sort, have a roll, and are comfortable on class III (and have run a IV or two) you should be fine... especially if you're used to New England's "technical" (i.e. rocky) runs.
Hope you can make it Heidi! (and Beach, Craig, Kneal, Martin...and our Mystery Guest (if you can make it feel free to post:) ).
Hudson Armada:)
Moderators: kenneth, sbroam, TheKrikkitWars, Mike W., Sir Adam, KNeal, PAC, adamin
Hudson Armada
A buddy and I are also thinking about joining the run and are wondering about logistics. What time do you usually meet and what is the location I should use to figure out drive time?
SHOULD I be able to attend, I may come up Thursday. If so, is anyone paddling Friday? I'll definitely paddle the Gorge on Sat. and hang around for whatever on Sun.--then start making the drive back.
Adam, since I'm planning on driving, can you go ahead and post a location so I can mapquest the directions and start planning on an actual start driving date?
Gettin' all excited
KNeal
Adam, since I'm planning on driving, can you go ahead and post a location so I can mapquest the directions and start planning on an actual start driving date?
Gettin' all excited
KNeal
C-boats Moderator
"Believe me, my young friend, there is nothing-absolutely nothing-half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats."
"Believe me, my young friend, there is nothing-absolutely nothing-half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats."
-
Sir Adam
- CBoats.net Staff
- Posts: 4136
- Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2002 12:00 am
- Location: Adirondacks, NY State, USA
- Contact:
I'll try to list all the important info:
Sat. meeting place will be WhiteWater Challengers in North River, NY 12856 at 9AM. We'll likely be standing around for a bit, but I want to be sure we have time to load boats, etc... For those from away, there are a few limited breakfast options in North Creek (5 mi south), and "normal" places (Dunkin Donuts, etc...) are 45 min away in Glens Falls.
Please let me know if you're coming so I can try and get a shuttle arranged...
Sunday will be figured out Saturday:)
For those heading this way, e-mail or PM me for directions to my house (Queensbury 12804) - we have lots of room to crash (and a dog and two cats), and quite a bit of space to camp if you'd prefer.
If you're looking for a "rustic" camping experience, you can camp at my barn at the end of Crane Mountain Road in Johnsburg, NY 12843. Roughly 30 min from the put in (my house is 40)...the barn is a lot closer, but you have to drive slowly the last mile or so as it's a seasonal use only road, and the town doesn't really maintain it.
There is running water (spring) at the barn, as well as an outhouse....that's about it though! Please let me know if you're camping in there so I can alert "the neighbors" such as they are:)
See y'all soon!
Sat. meeting place will be WhiteWater Challengers in North River, NY 12856 at 9AM. We'll likely be standing around for a bit, but I want to be sure we have time to load boats, etc... For those from away, there are a few limited breakfast options in North Creek (5 mi south), and "normal" places (Dunkin Donuts, etc...) are 45 min away in Glens Falls.
Please let me know if you're coming so I can try and get a shuttle arranged...
Sunday will be figured out Saturday:)
For those heading this way, e-mail or PM me for directions to my house (Queensbury 12804) - we have lots of room to crash (and a dog and two cats), and quite a bit of space to camp if you'd prefer.
If you're looking for a "rustic" camping experience, you can camp at my barn at the end of Crane Mountain Road in Johnsburg, NY 12843. Roughly 30 min from the put in (my house is 40)...the barn is a lot closer, but you have to drive slowly the last mile or so as it's a seasonal use only road, and the town doesn't really maintain it.
There is running water (spring) at the barn, as well as an outhouse....that's about it though! Please let me know if you're camping in there so I can alert "the neighbors" such as they are:)
See y'all soon!
Keep the C!
Adam
Adam
-
Sir Adam
- CBoats.net Staff
- Posts: 4136
- Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2002 12:00 am
- Location: Adirondacks, NY State, USA
- Contact:
Roll Call
Ok, I'll list (and update) the Official Roll Call here...if you're coming, and don't see your name here, let me know! I'm not going to type in folks names from above (as I know most were considering), so please post BELOW this e-mail, PM, or e-mail me.
Thank you:)
Adam
Official Hudson Fall Foliage Armada 2008
-Sir Adam
-rcgalwa (+?)
-LEW
-Lil'D
-Craig
-Beach
-C-Dawg
-Jim
It appears our "special guest" will not be able to join us, and may not be able to come down to the Northeast at all. Don't worry though, he's in one of the most beautiful, cold, wild places on earth
Thank you:)
Adam
Official Hudson Fall Foliage Armada 2008
-Sir Adam
-rcgalwa (+?)
-LEW
-Lil'D
-Craig
-Beach
-C-Dawg
-Jim
It appears our "special guest" will not be able to join us, and may not be able to come down to the Northeast at all. Don't worry though, he's in one of the most beautiful, cold, wild places on earth
Last edited by Sir Adam on Mon Sep 29, 2008 10:03 pm, edited 7 times in total.
Keep the C!
Adam
Adam
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the great gonzo
- Paddling Benefactor
- Posts: 1718
- Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 2:03 am
- Location: Montréal, Québec
I am planning on coming. My wife is hoping to come along(not boating though) ,she is willing to help with shuttle. Probably arriving 9ish Friday night and camp at the old barn if thats ok. Is it marked or easily found in the dark? I'm looking forward to meeting more C-Boaters and my first run of the Hudson!:)
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the great gonzo
- Paddling Benefactor
- Posts: 1718
- Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 2:03 am
- Location: Montréal, Québec
I will be joining the Armada and arriving early Friday afternoon. Let me know if I can help-out in any manner.
Where are all of the southern and western cboater brethren on this trip? Some of you southern folk haven't paddled north of the Mason and Dixon... c'mon up! I am wondering if cooler temps and a little frost on the boats in the morning are deterring folks. I forecast 70+ degrees and beautiful Adirondack colors... hoping at least...
C y'all there,
Kevin
Where are all of the southern and western cboater brethren on this trip? Some of you southern folk haven't paddled north of the Mason and Dixon... c'mon up! I am wondering if cooler temps and a little frost on the boats in the morning are deterring folks. I forecast 70+ degrees and beautiful Adirondack colors... hoping at least...
C y'all there,
Kevin
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sbroam
- CBoats.net Staff
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- Location: Lexington, SC
- Contact:
It's not the temps keeping me away - it's the distance, time, $5 gas, school has started for all 4 kids, etc... Maybe next summer - I think the downriver nationals are to be in Maine, my wife's cousin (in ME) is having a baby soon, etc...
C-Boats Moderator
http://picasaweb.google.com/scott.broam/CanoeOutfitting
http://picasaweb.google.com/scott.broam/CanoeOutfitting
I'll be there
Count me in for Sat's run on the Hudson, I will probably stay over and leave early Sunday. Unless it rains... I have a Remix 69 that I have used one weekend.
C-ing is believing!
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Sir Adam
- CBoats.net Staff
- Posts: 4136
- Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2002 12:00 am
- Location: Adirondacks, NY State, USA
- Contact:
It will be great to see you again C-Dawg!
I've talked to a local outfitter, and if they have a trip they're going to try and help us out with the shuttle - between them and a few of the offer's we've had from folks traveling but not paddling on Saturday we should be good to go.
Please do try and be at WhiteWater Challengers in North River at 9 am though - we need to be loaded up and on our way around 9:30 if we can be.
So far I have one group camping at the barn, and at least one crashing here at the house. Plenty of extra room at both locations, so let me know if anyone needs a place to stay so I can get directions to you.
Right now the river is low, but we're expecting a lot of rain over the next 5 days.
PM or e-mail me any questions.
I've also heard from a number of folks that they are heading out on Sunday. If you DO plan on being around on Sunday, please let me know, and I'll gear paddling plans towards whomever remains around....perhaps we'll have to look for a few seams
I've talked to a local outfitter, and if they have a trip they're going to try and help us out with the shuttle - between them and a few of the offer's we've had from folks traveling but not paddling on Saturday we should be good to go.
Please do try and be at WhiteWater Challengers in North River at 9 am though - we need to be loaded up and on our way around 9:30 if we can be.
So far I have one group camping at the barn, and at least one crashing here at the house. Plenty of extra room at both locations, so let me know if anyone needs a place to stay so I can get directions to you.
Right now the river is low, but we're expecting a lot of rain over the next 5 days.
PM or e-mail me any questions.
I've also heard from a number of folks that they are heading out on Sunday. If you DO plan on being around on Sunday, please let me know, and I'll gear paddling plans towards whomever remains around....perhaps we'll have to look for a few seams
Keep the C!
Adam
Adam
-
Sir Adam
- CBoats.net Staff
- Posts: 4136
- Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2002 12:00 am
- Location: Adirondacks, NY State, USA
- Contact:
Info on the weekend, AND the Gorge...
It is an ALL DAY trip, and I'll ask that you have a solid or semi-solid roll. There are two class IV rapids even at lower levels, but both are portagable.
Please post, PM, or e-mail me if you're going to join us - I'll add your username to the list above.
I can provide free camping with potable water and an outhouse.
A less than complete but rather lenghty description of the Hudson that I posted for a previous fall armada...use the search function (for "Hudson" to find all the related posts...):
The Hudson is most likely different than most rivers many of you have run in several respects-
1) It's a long wilderness trip
2) The rapids (at "normal" fall levels-3-5') are technical, not big
3) The river, though not as wide as the Ottawa in all spots, is fairly wide-there is more than just 1 line down the river, and with only a few exceptions (namely the class IV rapids) you can pretty much boat where you'd like (although some lines are easier than others)
So, here we go-THE HUDSON:
The first 3 miles are actually on the Indian River -3 miles of class III, with one great spot to regroup, and several smaller ones. The first rapid is Indian Head, followed by the Finch Pruyn Islands (regrouping spot, not really a rapid), and Gooley Steps. This is fairly continuous class III stuff-if you are comfortable paddling in moving water (read waves and small holes) you'll be fine. Also, at normal fall levels the Indian, though only class III, will be the toughest part of the day (due to it's continuous nature).
Then the Confluence with the Hudson. This is the last point you can take out for many miles (and even here requires a bit of a walk, but there is a road at least, though it is private)
The first rapid on the Hudson is Cedar Ledges. Class IIish at normal fall levels, IIIish if higher, but really a float and chat for most folks.
We can stop off at Virgin Falls (nice little water fall on the side of the river where a stream enters into the Hudson) and stretch our legs a bit
Next is Blue Ledge-at 5' or so I think it is defined as Class V in an old guide book-I seriously DO NOT SEE IT. Class III, yes, and V when there is A LOT of water, but seriously, it's no more difficult than the Indian. This is the half-way point by mileage, but not time.
Just below this is a GREAT surf wave river right (and a great squirt line above it in Blue Ledge Pool, also river right). There is a public trail into the river at this point (3 miles round trip, I think), and it's a good lunch spot.
The surf wave is the very top of the Narrows, the bottom of which is the first class IV of the day. It is portageable. It features BIG waves (not ottawa-sized, though), and one hole to avoid (very easy to avoid it, again, if your comfortable paddling in moving water).
Below the Narrows is Osprey Nest, a fun little bouncy class III, and a HUGE pool (square eddy) to regroup in).
After Square Eddy is Carters, or Split Rock. There is a hole river center (the appropriately named "Big Nasty" (hear that KNeal? BIG NASTY ) to avoid, but it's super easy if you know it's there. Carters is long, but there are eddys to catch, and it's class IIIish. You do need to watch out for "Little Nasty"(another souse hole) near the end, but at lower levels (3') the rock that causes it is out of the water.
After Carters is OK Slip, which is short with some pools,
This leads into Giveny's Rift, the second class IV of the day, and the most serious water on this section of the river. Again, it is portageable. J. would no doubt have fun playing in it, but the rest of us will most likely just run it straight. It's short, and there is a bit pool at the bottom, but there are a lot of rocks, and the currents are strong. For those that have paddled the North Branch, think of a bigger, longer, steeper Robins Nest. Multiple small drops to paddle through (no really trashy holes at this level, though).
After that is Gunsight In and Out (fun little class IIIs agian), and Harris (aka Mile Long). Fairly continuous class II/III, with a few holes right off river-right on shore to avoid.
Next is Greyhound Bus Stop, and almost river-wide play feature (hole in this case). A great way to end the day is to use what energy remains here Nice eddy, and very deep after the ledge itself (remember to tuck on those windowshades...). There is also a nice surf wave just above it.
The last few miles are float or paddle, depending on how tired everyone is. If the rive is up (closer to 5') it's a quick float. Closer to 3' and it's a long float unless you paddle (I think it's 2 Miles or so, though it may be 3).
A consistent roll and comfort in moving water is required, as this is a long trip, and it will be fall paddling in New England (as previously mentioned, most folks from south of NYS will most likely be most comfortable in a drytop.) The scenery is unbelievably gorgous (no pun intended ), especially during this time of year (fall foliage).
Anyone else that would like to add there thought on the Hudson, please do so-I've been guiding the gorge for the past 15 years, and it's familiar territory to me.
In case you wonder what sorts of boats travel this regularly, XXX, Z's, Forplays and Scores are not uncommon. The river manager for one rafting company "safety boats" in an S6. I makes for a loooong day, but he has fun.
Depending on what the level is, the temps are, and what other folks are paddling, I'll likely paddle my Sith, Viper, or Fanatic II.
--------------------
If you need a place to crash, camping or otherwise, let me know.
Otherwise, meeting point is Whitewater Challengers in North River, NY (roughly 5 miles north of North Creek on Rt 28).
Realizing most of you will be coming from the south, PLEASE UNDERSTAND THIS IS "garage sale" WEEKEND IN WARRENSBURG. This is "The Worlds Largest Garage Sale". So please go an alternate route (to Chestertown, then west on Route 8 to 28 in Wevertown (take a right, heading North) is a good easy one).
If you want to go through Warrensburg, it's exit 23 off I-87 (the "Northway", not to be confused with exit 23 off the "Thruway"...they are about an hour apart...)
-Left at the end of the ramp (towards Warrensburg)
-RIGHT at the light on to Rt. 9 heading north (towards Warrensburg)
-Through Warrensburg (as best you can)
-A few miles outside of Warrensburg LEFT at the flashing light on to Rt. 28 towards Wevertown / North Creek
-Straight through the light in Wevertown (this is the intersection with Rt. 8 coming from Chestertown if you take that exit instead)
-Gas up and get any food you need at the Stewarts gas station just outside of North Creek
-Continue on Rt. 28 to North River- the Hudson will be on your RIGHT, look for Whitewater Challengers (and their purple busses) on the LEFT.
Meeting time is 9 am Sat. morning.
If anyone needs specific directions other than what has been provided so far, please let me know, and let me know where you're coming from. Likewise, if you have any questions, PM or e-mail me.
It is an ALL DAY trip, and I'll ask that you have a solid or semi-solid roll. There are two class IV rapids even at lower levels, but both are portagable.
Please post, PM, or e-mail me if you're going to join us - I'll add your username to the list above.
I can provide free camping with potable water and an outhouse.
A less than complete but rather lenghty description of the Hudson that I posted for a previous fall armada...use the search function (for "Hudson" to find all the related posts...):
The Hudson is most likely different than most rivers many of you have run in several respects-
1) It's a long wilderness trip
2) The rapids (at "normal" fall levels-3-5') are technical, not big
3) The river, though not as wide as the Ottawa in all spots, is fairly wide-there is more than just 1 line down the river, and with only a few exceptions (namely the class IV rapids) you can pretty much boat where you'd like (although some lines are easier than others)
So, here we go-THE HUDSON:
The first 3 miles are actually on the Indian River -3 miles of class III, with one great spot to regroup, and several smaller ones. The first rapid is Indian Head, followed by the Finch Pruyn Islands (regrouping spot, not really a rapid), and Gooley Steps. This is fairly continuous class III stuff-if you are comfortable paddling in moving water (read waves and small holes) you'll be fine. Also, at normal fall levels the Indian, though only class III, will be the toughest part of the day (due to it's continuous nature).
Then the Confluence with the Hudson. This is the last point you can take out for many miles (and even here requires a bit of a walk, but there is a road at least, though it is private)
The first rapid on the Hudson is Cedar Ledges. Class IIish at normal fall levels, IIIish if higher, but really a float and chat for most folks.
We can stop off at Virgin Falls (nice little water fall on the side of the river where a stream enters into the Hudson) and stretch our legs a bit
Next is Blue Ledge-at 5' or so I think it is defined as Class V in an old guide book-I seriously DO NOT SEE IT. Class III, yes, and V when there is A LOT of water, but seriously, it's no more difficult than the Indian. This is the half-way point by mileage, but not time.
Just below this is a GREAT surf wave river right (and a great squirt line above it in Blue Ledge Pool, also river right). There is a public trail into the river at this point (3 miles round trip, I think), and it's a good lunch spot.
The surf wave is the very top of the Narrows, the bottom of which is the first class IV of the day. It is portageable. It features BIG waves (not ottawa-sized, though), and one hole to avoid (very easy to avoid it, again, if your comfortable paddling in moving water).
Below the Narrows is Osprey Nest, a fun little bouncy class III, and a HUGE pool (square eddy) to regroup in).
After Square Eddy is Carters, or Split Rock. There is a hole river center (the appropriately named "Big Nasty" (hear that KNeal? BIG NASTY ) to avoid, but it's super easy if you know it's there. Carters is long, but there are eddys to catch, and it's class IIIish. You do need to watch out for "Little Nasty"(another souse hole) near the end, but at lower levels (3') the rock that causes it is out of the water.
After Carters is OK Slip, which is short with some pools,
This leads into Giveny's Rift, the second class IV of the day, and the most serious water on this section of the river. Again, it is portageable. J. would no doubt have fun playing in it, but the rest of us will most likely just run it straight. It's short, and there is a bit pool at the bottom, but there are a lot of rocks, and the currents are strong. For those that have paddled the North Branch, think of a bigger, longer, steeper Robins Nest. Multiple small drops to paddle through (no really trashy holes at this level, though).
After that is Gunsight In and Out (fun little class IIIs agian), and Harris (aka Mile Long). Fairly continuous class II/III, with a few holes right off river-right on shore to avoid.
Next is Greyhound Bus Stop, and almost river-wide play feature (hole in this case). A great way to end the day is to use what energy remains here Nice eddy, and very deep after the ledge itself (remember to tuck on those windowshades...). There is also a nice surf wave just above it.
The last few miles are float or paddle, depending on how tired everyone is. If the rive is up (closer to 5') it's a quick float. Closer to 3' and it's a long float unless you paddle (I think it's 2 Miles or so, though it may be 3).
A consistent roll and comfort in moving water is required, as this is a long trip, and it will be fall paddling in New England (as previously mentioned, most folks from south of NYS will most likely be most comfortable in a drytop.) The scenery is unbelievably gorgous (no pun intended ), especially during this time of year (fall foliage).
Anyone else that would like to add there thought on the Hudson, please do so-I've been guiding the gorge for the past 15 years, and it's familiar territory to me.
In case you wonder what sorts of boats travel this regularly, XXX, Z's, Forplays and Scores are not uncommon. The river manager for one rafting company "safety boats" in an S6. I makes for a loooong day, but he has fun.
Depending on what the level is, the temps are, and what other folks are paddling, I'll likely paddle my Sith, Viper, or Fanatic II.
--------------------
If you need a place to crash, camping or otherwise, let me know.
Otherwise, meeting point is Whitewater Challengers in North River, NY (roughly 5 miles north of North Creek on Rt 28).
Realizing most of you will be coming from the south, PLEASE UNDERSTAND THIS IS "garage sale" WEEKEND IN WARRENSBURG. This is "The Worlds Largest Garage Sale". So please go an alternate route (to Chestertown, then west on Route 8 to 28 in Wevertown (take a right, heading North) is a good easy one).
If you want to go through Warrensburg, it's exit 23 off I-87 (the "Northway", not to be confused with exit 23 off the "Thruway"...they are about an hour apart...)
-Left at the end of the ramp (towards Warrensburg)
-RIGHT at the light on to Rt. 9 heading north (towards Warrensburg)
-Through Warrensburg (as best you can)
-A few miles outside of Warrensburg LEFT at the flashing light on to Rt. 28 towards Wevertown / North Creek
-Straight through the light in Wevertown (this is the intersection with Rt. 8 coming from Chestertown if you take that exit instead)
-Gas up and get any food you need at the Stewarts gas station just outside of North Creek
-Continue on Rt. 28 to North River- the Hudson will be on your RIGHT, look for Whitewater Challengers (and their purple busses) on the LEFT.
Meeting time is 9 am Sat. morning.
If anyone needs specific directions other than what has been provided so far, please let me know, and let me know where you're coming from. Likewise, if you have any questions, PM or e-mail me.
Keep the C!
Adam
Adam
Great river description Adam! Nice to have as much paddling time on the river compared to the drive to the river. More enjoyable too!
I will be paddling an Ocoee and can bring a Wheelboy and two Viper C1s for Sunday. The Vipers are different cuts and may accommodate a couple of other Cboaters.
The forecast appears to be ideal for boating with peak foliage and no bugs.
Cz ya,
Kevin
I will be paddling an Ocoee and can bring a Wheelboy and two Viper C1s for Sunday. The Vipers are different cuts and may accommodate a couple of other Cboaters.
The forecast appears to be ideal for boating with peak foliage and no bugs.
Cz ya,
Kevin