Ugh... I've dreaded this day :(

[Craig Smerda]

I've been having knee trouble for the past few years. Two weekends ago while out paddling I stepped onto shore to dump some water out of my boat. My foot slipped on an icy rock and with my boat over my head I tried to stop myself from falling at which point my right knee literally gave out. In the past a treatment of rest, ice and ibuprofen has always taken care of the issue or at least gotten me by. 20+ years of working on concrete floors, foolishness in my youth and kneeling in a boat have taken their toll. Yesterday I finally went in to get it checked out... the verdict... both knees need Arthroscopic surgery... the right one being the worst by far. I informed the Doc that I was a whitewater paddler and that I kneeled in my boat. He wasn't really encouraging regarding the likelyhood of me bending my knees in a boat for hours on end in his response. I'm pretty torn up today considering the fact that I have a new boat coming out and because I love paddling whitewater more than nearly everything else in this world. I know what I'll have to do if I want to continue to paddle but I've dreaded that thought for over a decade... the thought that I'd have to sit in a boat with my legs out in front of me and use a two bladed paddle... and becoming one of "them".

[markzak]

Terrible news and I hope the best for a more then full recovery after surgery.

Recently a buddy broke a few vertebrates, got surgery and was out for a few months. During the PT, he asked his doctor when he might be able to go out and drop waterfalls again (he even brought in a picture of him running Wonder Falls on the Big Sandy). The doctor said... well, I wouldn't recommend anything like that to someone with a healthy spine, so I guess whenever you think you're ready.

Moral of the story, be smart but hopefully your love of boating will help you through surgery and recovery and get you back on the water sooner then expected.

[milkman]

Doctors aren't always right about what's possible after recovery. In fact, I think they tend to underpromise. Be religious about physical therapy and don't go the way of the butt boater until you've given it your best try. If you do end up in a kayak, there's much worse things in life. Several of my friends who have switched to kayaking because of kneeling issues are loving it.

[Big Al]

You'll come through it.

After 12 years of playing rugby resulting in 5 knee operations (medial collateral and interior cruciate ligament reconstruction in one knee and three arthoscopic surgeries in the other for cartilage repair) I'm ok.
Yeah, I get real stiff and sore knees after sometimes just a few minutes kneeling in my OC1, but doesn't everyone? I attribute the therapy after the operations (over 12 years ago now) and my regular routine of weight lifting including squats, leg press, leg curls, etc. at allowing me to continue paddling.

Docs are always going to steer you to the conservative line.

Good luck!

[Todhunter]

Craig,

Do you know the gist of what they are going to do arthroscopically? Are they going to look and see, or do they already have a game plan? I have a medical device background, in particular, artificial cartilage for knees. Is your articular cartilage worn, if so how large of an area?

[Peter]

Are you having surgery on your knees or to have your balls surgically removed?























Good Job by the way!

[Craig Smerda]

Good Job by the way!

Well... it's at least partially true. I do have one knee that's on the way out... and I did slip two weeks ago while on some ice due to it giving out. I've spent two decades working on concrete floors (not always with proper footwear or body alignment), I've done foolish things and hurt them and as I've aged I can't spend nearly the time I used to in the boat without getting out and stretching. Sooner or later... I'm going to have to get something done... hopefully not "sooner" though. Dang... now I'm feeling sort've guilty after such kind thoughts and good informative posts.

Trust me on this... I don't wanna be a kayaker!!!


I did consider bumping last years "NEWSFLASH... NEW DECKED C-1 FROM ESQUIF CANOES!!!" AFJ
http://www.cboats.net/cforum/viewtopic. ... 3850#43850

[horizongfx]

Had ACL Reconstruction Surgery about 7 years ago,(Right Knee) And Tore the Meniscus as well, Re tore Newly Reconstructed Ligament a couple years ago at Grumpys (Ocoee) Guiding a raft.
Just went to doctor this year and they were very eager to operate again, I remembered it was 2 years b4 I could bend said knee enuff to get back in canoe, prior to the 1st tear I was in C-1, I had to accept the fact that I would probably never C-1 again, as long as I can bend it enuff to get back in my beloved OC-1 I'm fine with that.
Now Left Knee Pops and Grinds and Is Unstable, so I'm sure it Needs some work as well. I'm going to put it off as long as I can, because it will affect 2 things, My Work and My Play !
I wish you all the Best with it, and Know exactly what Kind of mental Torment it is to have to consider The Option of a lesser craft.

[horizongfx]

Had ACL Reconstruction Surgery about 7 years ago,(Right Knee) And Tore the Meniscus as well, Re tore Newly Reconstructed Ligament a couple years ago at Grumpys (Ocoee) Guiding a raft.
Just went to doctor this year and they were very eager to operate again, I remembered it was 2 years b4 I could bend said knee enuff to get back in canoe, prior to the 1st tear I was in C-1, I had to accept the fact that I would probably never C-1 again, as long as I can bend it enuff to get back in my beloved OC-1 I'm fine with that.
Now Left Knee Pops and Grinds and Is Unstable, so I'm sure it Needs some work as well. I'm going to put it off as long as I can, because it will affect 2 things, My Work and My Play !
I wish you all the Best with it, and Know exactly what Kind of mental Torment it is to have to consider The Option of a lesser craft.

Guess you got me as well But what I said above is true and Fact, I never considered the Kayak option, but I might consider Soloing a shredder.

[FullGnarlzOC]

you'll be fine. rehab. and suck it up. docs are uber conservative. whitewater boaters are not.

2 acls within the last 4 years; can sit on my knees now better than i ever could.

it sounds like its too soon for you to turn to the dark side... resist.

[horizongfx]

Trust me on this... I don't wanna be a kayaker!!!

Well Quit actin' like one and hangin out in the Kiddy Pool all the time [/quote]

[SkeeterGuy86]

dont go Kayak ..... on the insurance policy i had the fortunate reading the other day ... it had whitewater kayaking as a dangerous sport .... no where on there was whitewater Canoeing

hope all turns out well Craig ... god knows in 20 years my knees will be shot

[Bob P]

The good news is that arthroscopic surgery can be amazing. I had an ACL done a couple of years ago. I walked out of the hospital 3 hours after the surgery, and was back in the boat within 3 weeks. Hopefully, your experience won't be much different. Good Luck!

[Paddler]

I' sorry to hear about your injury, and I hope that things turn out better in the end. But one thing you must ask yourself is do you float rivers to be in a canoe or do you float rivers for the sake of being on the river? As a canoer/kayaker/rafter I've always taken comfort in just being on the water. I started my whitewater career in a kayak, and since then have been trying to find ways to grow and expand my experience on the water. Canoeing offers a different type of experience and different way to run the river but so does kayaking, cat boating, or SUP. I hope that you won't allow your dedication to Canoeing ruin your experience on the water. When I talk to my kayaking buddies about C-boating and they say that it's stupid, i just tell the that they are missing the point, and I' going to say the same thing to you, and to everyone else who applies such a narrow focus to running rivers. I'm not saying give up on c-boating, but try and approach this with an open mind.

I hope that you are able to rehab, and get back in a canoe, but if you can't I hope that you won't turn your back on the other ways to run rivers. Hopefully all your C-boating friends will still talk to you if your show up to the put-in in a kayak, and if they don't well then I'll go boating with you.

[CDawg]

Paddling seems to have made the knee stronger, I have no pain in that knee when I paddle though it might be just dumb luck. If you go through with the surgery, get the very best doc available to you. I've had a couple surgeries at the Mayo Clinic in Rochester MN, no more expensive than any other, and good results. Mayo fixed my screwed up arthritic right elbow (elbows are notoriously hard to fix and easy to screw up), that elbow is so solid now, and NO pain. Good luck to you whatever you do.