Roll form

Smurfwarrior · Post by **Smurfwarrior** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:07 pm

If I flip to the offside, I backdeck roll. Easy and powerful roll that is very quick. I don't think its any more dangerous than 'facing the bottom' during a normal roll.

rockyboater · Post by **rockyboater** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:11 pm

I didn't realize that you pretty much come up in a standard onside roll. So the trick is, instead of tucking up on your offside, swing your body over the back of the boat and sweep all the way around and forward? Interested to try this more. Need a sure thing if I get caught on my offside and can't get under the boat. Can it be done from a static position already in the water on your offside?

wetnobby · Post by **wetnobby** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:17 pm

Yes it can be done from that position, it will take a bit of practice. For boats like the Zoom that like to sit on there side its way faster than trying to get the boat fully over and setting up for a std roll...

rockyboater · Post by **rockyboater** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:22 pm

I guess with a solid back deck roll there's little need for a offside roll at all. Time to hit a pool there's 3 feet of snow on the ground here right now... Cheers.

Shep · Post by **Shep** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:13 pm

No, I think the off-side roll is still a must. When I am in real WW, sometimes I am not thinking clearly in that first few seconds of things going wrong. If you are leaning forward or get your paddle stuck you also may have a hard time setting up for the back-deck. I am still getting used to my back-deck roll, and am looking forward to getting some rain someday to try it out "in the wild".

Thanks,
Shep

Smurfwarrior · Post by **Smurfwarrior** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:35 pm

Actually, I use the back deck roll 'in the wild' all the time, when I flip to the offside and am out of position to duck forward under the boat to set up for a normal onside roll. Never tried a offside roll other than just bracing up in a hole.

yarnellboat · Post by **yarnellboat** » Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:05 am

Rocky,

To me the back deck roll is pretty much the same as a normal roll. The finish is more or less the same - as you noticed, it's just that you lean back and sweep under your stetn deck instead of tucking forward and sweeping under your bow.

To make that work for my mind & body when upsidedown in the water though, I needed to go to my standard set-up position out at 90-degrees, and then back it up from there to get an idea of how to come under the stern deck with my paddle/body. Goggles helped.

The movement is not as intuitive for me. Unlike the normal roll, if I haven't practiced going under the back deck in recent memory, I probably wouldn't get it on the river.

So, try going from the set-up of your normal roll backwards to under the back deck.

Pat.

rockyboater · Post by **rockyboater** » Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:29 am

I'll play with the back deck for sure. I've tried the offside for years and only got it once in a pool. It just seems so wrong.... I've only seen it in books and can't figure it out. As soon as I go over I loose a sense of where I am and what to do? I usually get half way then run out of paddle stroke. Not something i'd ever resort to on the river.

Shep · Post by **Shep** » Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:58 am

Oh, I think I was being lazy in my reading and posting. I interpreted the earlier question as: "So it doesn't matter if a back-deck roll is the only way I roll when I flip to my off-side." I do think rolling up on the offside is beyond most human canoeists, but I think being able to roll up when you flip to the offside in the "traditional" manner is also important, even if you have a back-deck roll.

Sorry for the confusion,
Shep

Smurfwarrior · Post by **Smurfwarrior** » Tue Jan 11, 2011 1:03 am

Shep- oh yeah, when I'm in the middle of the boat or in the forward quadrant when I flip I set up and roll as normal on the onside. Its just when thrown overboard to the offside or leaning back or whatnot is when I initiate the beck deck.. Its so fast and nifty, gotta get that one in your bag of tricks. Works great in a csquirt too...

Smurfwarrior · Post by **Smurfwarrior** » Tue Jan 11, 2011 1:24 am

http://www.vimeo.com/18072117

Here is a vid of my back deck rolls so you can see how quick they can be. So you don't have to suffer through the whole thing they are at - 2:40 3:00 4:20 and 4:28

coloradopaddler · Post by **coloradopaddler** » Sat Jan 15, 2011 12:39 am

i've got to say, after reading this post i had to try it, no thanks to another c boater.

i went to the pool on tuesday and saw a kayaker doing a back deck roll. i asked him to show me the steps and he broke it down for me and my kayaker friend.
i nailed the first one! i was amazed that i was breathing air. i'm not trying to brag, since i missed the second one, but i'm sold. it is super fast and i didn't feel any strain in my shoulders. it's certainly a situation specific roll. it takes some commitment to try that first one, since it's such an unnatural position to initiate, but its also good "combat roll" practice, since if you miss it you are totally out of position for a normal roll.

rockyboater · Post by **rockyboater** » Sat Jan 15, 2011 12:45 am

coloradopaddler wrote:i've got to say, after reading this post i had to try it, no thanks to another c boater.

C boaters are people too:) Nice work on the roll though.

yuanyelss · Post by **yuanyelss** » Sat Jan 15, 2011 7:34 am

I use the same style of roll as the traditional static setup didn't work for me. Occasionally the squirrley water grabs the blade and I have to reset but I'm use to it.

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rockyboater · Post by **rockyboater** » Sat Jan 15, 2011 8:58 am

Found this vid with a offside role. Still not sure I can pull it off??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=adHrpKny ... re=related