Snowboard straps on glass
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Snowboard straps on glass
I've seen a few people using the snowboard boot strap and ratchets for thigh straps in converted plastic yaks. Has anybody installed these in a glass boat? I would like to put them in mine but the bottom part of the system has nothing to bolt to. I could probably make something out of abs or find some vinyl pads with gromets. Has anybody else done this?
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Home Builder
Well, I don't know doodle about ski boots or snowboards. I looked at a couple of internet pictures of such products, but am still not really familiar with exactly how the straps attach to the boards.
Having pleaded ignorant on the subject, and because of the dearth of responses to date, consider the following:
You could make the brackets for the bolts out of bias-cut fiberglass cloth using epoxy or vinyl ester resin. Incorporate any needed fittings when making the brackets. You will probably have to make a plug/mold for the bracket shape you want using scrap foam, cardboard, or anything else you can easily form into the shape you need.
The hull of your boat where the bracket will be attached should be used in this process to the extent possible to minimize cutting and sanding the part to make it fit the curve of the hull.
Apply plenty of wax, saran wrap, wax paper, more wax, or a release agent on any portion of the plug/mold you don't want to be part of the bracket.
Lay-up the bracket on the well-waxed "plug/mold" you have fashioned.
When the bracket has been formed, cured, released, fitted, and the joining areas prepared (sanded) for attachment, glass it into place just like you would any other outfitting anchor point.
Alternatively, can you simply glass in an aluminum tube or piece of plastic pipe that will receive the bolts? Just prepare the surfaces carefully (clean and rough the appropriate areas of the hull), and use a layer or two of chopped glass fibers between the hull and the bias-cut fiberglass cloth (or seaming tape) you apply to attach the fitting. Follow Walbridge's instructions for attaching C-boat outfitting with glass cloth and resin.
If you do it right, the glassed in attachments will be as resistant to breakage as the hull of your boat. The bond between the two will be almost as strong as the original bonds of the hull laminate.
It will certainly be stronger than any bond you are going to get using ABS or vinyl pads and resin or other adhesives.
But frankly, it sounds like a pretty heavy thigh retaining system to put in a composite boat. Isn't the idea of such high performance craft to keep it tight, but light?
(Consider that Jon Lugbill didn't use ratchets and ski boot straps to stay in his race boats. He paddled C-boats twice a day most days a year, and he cranked down on his thigh straps as tight as anyone else. His paddling/racing/training style was a very aggressive one, so I am pretty sure he put more torque on the outfitting of his four meter race boats than most recreational paddlers will ever generate.)
Having pleaded ignorant on the subject, and because of the dearth of responses to date, consider the following:
You could make the brackets for the bolts out of bias-cut fiberglass cloth using epoxy or vinyl ester resin. Incorporate any needed fittings when making the brackets. You will probably have to make a plug/mold for the bracket shape you want using scrap foam, cardboard, or anything else you can easily form into the shape you need.
The hull of your boat where the bracket will be attached should be used in this process to the extent possible to minimize cutting and sanding the part to make it fit the curve of the hull.
Apply plenty of wax, saran wrap, wax paper, more wax, or a release agent on any portion of the plug/mold you don't want to be part of the bracket.
Lay-up the bracket on the well-waxed "plug/mold" you have fashioned.
When the bracket has been formed, cured, released, fitted, and the joining areas prepared (sanded) for attachment, glass it into place just like you would any other outfitting anchor point.
Alternatively, can you simply glass in an aluminum tube or piece of plastic pipe that will receive the bolts? Just prepare the surfaces carefully (clean and rough the appropriate areas of the hull), and use a layer or two of chopped glass fibers between the hull and the bias-cut fiberglass cloth (or seaming tape) you apply to attach the fitting. Follow Walbridge's instructions for attaching C-boat outfitting with glass cloth and resin.
If you do it right, the glassed in attachments will be as resistant to breakage as the hull of your boat. The bond between the two will be almost as strong as the original bonds of the hull laminate.
It will certainly be stronger than any bond you are going to get using ABS or vinyl pads and resin or other adhesives.
But frankly, it sounds like a pretty heavy thigh retaining system to put in a composite boat. Isn't the idea of such high performance craft to keep it tight, but light?
(Consider that Jon Lugbill didn't use ratchets and ski boot straps to stay in his race boats. He paddled C-boats twice a day most days a year, and he cranked down on his thigh straps as tight as anyone else. His paddling/racing/training style was a very aggressive one, so I am pretty sure he put more torque on the outfitting of his four meter race boats than most recreational paddlers will ever generate.)
Thanks for the tips.
I undestand what you are saying about keeping the boat light but the thought was more on comfort and saftey. The binding straps don't really weigh that much, probably just a bit more than the straps, d-rings and buckles. They are about 3" wide and padded with a ratcheting mechanism that has a quick release tab that's designed to work even when packed full of ice and snow which for me means no more searching for the monkey fist knots on the end of my straps, just hit the inch long tab and the staps release into two pieces. I checked out a local paddlers boat and tried them and there was a considerable amount of comfort difference. Also when I'm practicing rolls or even just paddling I notice that my straps loosen up, the ratchet types should stay snug longer. I'll more than likely try them in a plastic boat before I put them in a glass boat.
I undestand what you are saying about keeping the boat light but the thought was more on comfort and saftey. The binding straps don't really weigh that much, probably just a bit more than the straps, d-rings and buckles. They are about 3" wide and padded with a ratcheting mechanism that has a quick release tab that's designed to work even when packed full of ice and snow which for me means no more searching for the monkey fist knots on the end of my straps, just hit the inch long tab and the staps release into two pieces. I checked out a local paddlers boat and tried them and there was a considerable amount of comfort difference. Also when I'm practicing rolls or even just paddling I notice that my straps loosen up, the ratchet types should stay snug longer. I'll more than likely try them in a plastic boat before I put them in a glass boat.
In some of my glass boats, a piece of webbing has been glassed to the hull in order to make a d-ring. If you are careful you might be able to put the webbing trough your straps and then glass the webbing to your boat. This will keep it as light as possible and eliminate bulk. It will probably also be stronger than gluing something. You will have to take some time to keep everything tight so that it doesn't slip and you keep the benefit of the ratchet adjustments.
- Paul
- Paul
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HB
Pevans is a quick learn. "Glassing in" is the best (only?) way to attach anything to a composite boat.
D-rings can be glassed in directly or by using a piece of webbing.
When attaching directly, wax the rings very well so they can rotate under the glass that you apply over the "back" of the D to secure it to the composite.
If using webbing, get the climbers' nylon tubular webbing (it is much stronger than the flat-weave stuff.) Fray the ends by removing the continuous warp thread from an inch or more on each end. This will allow the fibers to spread in a fan-shaped manner when you wet it out. That way, you get maximum contact with the hull.
That takes care of the looped end of the strap.
The "bolt hole" end of the strap can be attached to a simple bracket with a hole in it to receive the bolt/pop rivet after it has passed through the strap.
The easiest bracket for the strap end with the bolt hole can be made with L-shaped aluminum stock. Round and smooth the corners and edges after cutting the length to suit. Drill a hole in one flange, glass the other flange to the hull.
Do one side of the boat at a time. If you try to do two, the area inside the cockpit will seem to "shrink" and things will get messy very quick. Take your time, and know that it will take at least two sessions with the resins. Use saran wrap or wax paper taped to the hull, rim, etc. to collect and control the resin while to the squeege work. Trying to rush this stuff will show in the finished work.
Let every thing cure for a couple days before using it.
D-rings can be glassed in directly or by using a piece of webbing.
When attaching directly, wax the rings very well so they can rotate under the glass that you apply over the "back" of the D to secure it to the composite.
If using webbing, get the climbers' nylon tubular webbing (it is much stronger than the flat-weave stuff.) Fray the ends by removing the continuous warp thread from an inch or more on each end. This will allow the fibers to spread in a fan-shaped manner when you wet it out. That way, you get maximum contact with the hull.
That takes care of the looped end of the strap.
The "bolt hole" end of the strap can be attached to a simple bracket with a hole in it to receive the bolt/pop rivet after it has passed through the strap.
The easiest bracket for the strap end with the bolt hole can be made with L-shaped aluminum stock. Round and smooth the corners and edges after cutting the length to suit. Drill a hole in one flange, glass the other flange to the hull.
Do one side of the boat at a time. If you try to do two, the area inside the cockpit will seem to "shrink" and things will get messy very quick. Take your time, and know that it will take at least two sessions with the resins. Use saran wrap or wax paper taped to the hull, rim, etc. to collect and control the resin while to the squeege work. Trying to rush this stuff will show in the finished work.
Let every thing cure for a couple days before using it.