vynabond vs. 3m Urethane epoxy for D-rings?

Post by **sbroam** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 10:34 pm

There is NO vynabond in this town! One outfitter suggested 3m urethane epoxy - is this a good idea for D-rings on royalex?

yarnellboat · Post by **yarnellboat** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 11:35 pm

If you can't find Vinylbond (the product here is VinylTec 2000) for your d-rings-on-vinyl-patches, then maybe you can find non-patch d-rings?

You know those d-rings - a metal D that fits under a hard, plastic strip. If you are attaching those types of d-rings then the 3M epoxy is great.

P.

OC1_SURFER · Post by **OC1_SURFER** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 12:23 am

I have outfitted and reoutfitted several royalex canoes. Most of the boats that I have purchased have been used. One of the biggest problems I have encountered in reoutfitting a used WW canoe is eliminating the old epoxy that the previous owner has unwittingly used to glue his D-rings, toe blocks, knee boots, etc. As far as I know, there is no solvent that will dissolve epoxy. You do get a strong bond with it, however if you ever want to change positions of your outfitting, you're screwed! I usually end up taking a Dremel with a small grinding bit and just smoothing it out. It is very easy to go too far with it though. That inner layer of hull vinyl is pretty thin.

I only use vynabond for my vinyl D-rings and other vinyl outfitting (contact cement for minicell). A vynabonded D-ring is relatively easy to remove. Just heat it with a hair dryer and then pull it off with a pair of pliers. And there will be very little residue.

Whenever I'm in a WW shop, I always stock up on vynabond if they have any. Some shops don't even carry it anymore. If you can find it, I suggest forgetting the epoxy. You'll be doing yourself a favor, as well as the next owner of the boat. Who knows, the next owner might be ME!

T.P.

Larry Horne · Post by **Larry Horne** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 12:30 am

I remember having bad luck with the hard plastic d-rings and 3m.
I think NRS and NOC have vynabond.

Post by **sbroam** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 12:36 am

Thanks - that's kind of what I thought. I've always had good luck with Vynabond and only used the epoxy once in a boat with the polycarbonate (?) d-ring mounts and that later broke! Oh, I did use PC-7 to put D-rings on my Pelican box. Besides, the guy (his name is actually "Guy") who was recommending the epoxy is not exactly reliable...

Come to think of it, I did have some Vynabonded d-rings fail once - the vinyl layer of the *royalex* pulled away from the *ABS*...

Another outfitting Q coming up...

Scott

yarnellboat · Post by **yarnellboat** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 1:36 am

Sounds like good advice on the d-rings - the epoxy is a nightmare to remove!

Come to think of it, I did have some Vynabonded d-rings fail once - the vinyl layer of the *royalex* pulled away from the *ABS*...

Make certain to allow sufficient drying time for the adhesive, otherwise it continues to "gas" and effects the Royalex as you said. I'm sure somebody has a better explanation.

P.

Post by **sbroam** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 1:46 am

I've always used two coats and taken a hair dryer to the two surfaces before bringing them together - I think I got that out of an NOC catalog once. I've also heard of excess Vynabond softening a hull to near failure.

The failure I experience was from leaving fully inflated bags in the boat, on my truck, in the SC summer heat. There were webbing straps retaining the bags clipped to d-rings on the hull. They peeled away, taking the vinyl with them... Yes, I felt stupid

pevans · Post by **pevans** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 2:20 am

When I talked to Mohawk canoes they used DAP contact in the red can (the green is water soluable) and I've never had any problems in my probe. I dont know how well this would work on the hard based d-rings though.

Good luck,
Paul

billcanoes · Post by **billcanoes** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 4:27 am

Scott,

I know you want the vynabond to get you boat ready for GAF- I'm pretty sure I have a tube I can bring with me- I might be doing the tuck on Fri..??? maybe we can meet there so you can start your outfitting??? I bought 10 tubes from NOC and have 2 left,
I'm also meeting a friend tomorrow at lower green who lives in greenville- not sure how far that is for you??? Call my cell early tomorrow and I'll give it to her. Or you could stop by tomorrow in Charlotte after 6

I'll bring the vynabond with me tomorrow - either doing Lower Green Upper Green or Park and Play at French Broad 6-

Oh- you might also want to check pool supplies- they sometimes carry vynyl adhesive, in a blue and white tube which is supposed to be vynabond in a different package- I bought this in Charlotte and it was $4.95 a tube instead of $2.95. It worked.

704-604-6687 --
Bill

Post by **sbroam** » Thu Oct 28, 2004 11:15 am

Lo and hehold, I went to the shop myself and rummaged around on my own and what did I find - 2 tubes of vynabond. Now the boat is in much better shape for his inaugural Nantahala float!

ezwater · Post by **ezwater** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 3:32 am

What is this 3M "epoxy"?? I have 2 part 3M urethane structural adhesive, have used it to glue in pedestals and some d-rings, though for d-rings I'm happy to use Vynabond. \

I have West epoxy, but would never use epoxy for glueing d-rings or fittings. I do use West for putting layered glass cloth graunch pads onto ABS boat ends, AFTER stripping the vinyl layer off the ABS. Epoxy bonds better to ABS than to vinyl.

Post by **sbroam** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 9:20 am

g2d wrote:What is this 3M "epoxy"?? I have 2 part 3M urethane structural adhesive, have used it to glue in pedestals and some d-rings, though for d-rings I'm happy to use Vynabond.

It's probably not "epoxy" but what you named - I got the name over the phone from a questionable source, not off of a label. I just use the DAP contact cement for pedesdals and pads on both vinyl and PE.

C-Forum

vynabond vs. 3m Urethane epoxy for D-rings?

vynabond vs. 3m Urethane epoxy for D-rings?

NO to epoxy!!!

Vynabond

lo and behold