Outfitting removal?

[Slowfoot]

I bought a used OC from a guy 2' shorter than me (Probe II with factory outfitting), and would like to get the saddle and knee cups and d-rings out in such a way that the new stuff glues in well and holds. I was planning on cutting most of the minicell out with a bread knife and then sanding down to the hull or old glue as carefully as possible.

Am I on the right track, or is there a better way? How do I get the old anchors out? TIA.

[Mike W.]

The easiest way to get foam out is with a length of cross-connect wire strung between two handles (tent stakes). Find a phone company guy & ask him for 3' of cross-connect wire if you can't find 24 gauge anywhere. Work it back & forth like a saw to cut the foam.

For anchors, use a heat gun & pliers. It's amazing how easily the anchors pull up. Just be careful with the heat.

When you get ready to put everything back in check this thread:
http://cboats.net/cforum/viewtopic.php?t=5034

[OC1_SURFER]

Slowfoot, I would not use a bread knife. Most of the ones I've seen have a very sharp edge which might cut into the vinyl layer of the hull. Instead, I use a very flexible putty knife to separate the minicell from the hull. I just go around the perimeter of the saddle or knee pad and gently slide the putty knife between the two surfaces until the outfitting is loose. If the minicell was attached with contact cement (as it should be), a FEW drops of laquer thinner and a hair dryer will soften up the residue enough so that you can roll it up as if it were chewing gum.

If the outfitting was glued in with epoxy (which I think is a mistake), you will not be able to remove the residue. You will be able to smooth it down by sanding, but I would be careful not to get into the vinyl.

If the D-rings were attached with Vynabond (as they should be), then, starting on the edge, heat the vinyl patch with the hair dryer. Use the putty knife to separate about 1/8" of the patch, then use a pair of pliers to SLOWLY pull on the patch while heating it. If you notice that the hull vinyl is coming loose, then you are applying too much heat. I'm usually not concerned with the residue from Vynabond. Just leave it. You can attach new outfitting over it with no affect.

A few final words: I have been outfitting Royalex canoes for over 17 years and have very rarely used two-part epoxy. If your outfitting is minicell & vinyl, then use contact cement on the minicell and Vynabond on the vinyl. If used correctly, you should be able to get a lasting bond with these products.

Hope this helps.

Terry P.

[Tiggy]

remove as much of the old glue as possible, may even want to use new anchor points to truly make it custom, good luck and dont get high on the fumes!

[Cone Bone]

If the old foam pedestal is in good shape where it contacts the hull, and the bond is still strong, you might save yourself some work by not cutting the old foam completely out. A careful cut with a small saw, or with the wire saw suggested by Mike, could be made which would leave a low slab of foam in the boat that has a flat top. This could act as a convenient base for gluing in a new custom pedestal. Weldwood contact cement works well when gluing foam to foam.

[Slowfoot]

you might save yourself some work by not cutting the old foam completely out.

I thought about this, but didn't think I could cut it straight enough to make the new saddle fit right. Upon reflection, I really don't have anything to lose by trying - if I can't get a tight fit, I can just putty kinfe out the rest of the old one. Thanks, all, my 4th of July project begins today!

[steveinknoxville]

All you have to do to get the old contact cement off is to remove asmuch of the saddle and old foam as possible and lightly wet the area with mineral spritis - which is the solvent in the contact cement. After it is wet you can easily scrape of the old glue and it should look like a new boat. I have been doing this for years, since I do not buy new boats and I like to customize my outfit.
I agree with the other guy about the vynabond. Leave it. I do clean it carefully with a rag that has just a smidge of acetone on it - but beeeeeee careful with acetone, too much will melt the hull. The heat and the pliers is also a good way to get the old stuff off- use more pliers than heat. Hope I helped. Steve

[billcanoes]

Well, some folks might think this is a crazy solution, but depending on trim you might just have to move the knee cups, or what I did on my viper 11, was just removed the thwart cut the back of the saddle off and slid it back 1.5" glued the cut section and then drilled new holes for the thwart and reattached it.- thought I was just adjusting for trim, it would be rare I would have too much legt room

when cutting minicell a 12" miter saw works well when the foam is in its blick, but for this application a serrated kicthen knife is awesome, score the saddle first and make lots of small cuts pulling the knife in the same direction -sawing back and forth makes a sloppy cut

Try to be very patient with the vinyl- because it can get twisted easily which would cause air bubbles when reinstalling it- or better yet buy new anchors- I assume you have the lap belt style

[OC1_SURFER]

Bump...I just felt that this thread is pertinent to some of the questions on the board lately. I think there's some good info here.

T.P.

[Greg Y]

I had my d-ring pads all come loose on a Dagger Impulse, used vinylbond on them. It was a really hot day, over 100 I had the boat on top of my truck for several hours before I took it off. It had a Mohawk saddle and thigh strap on it, I ordered new pads and some vinylbond from Mohawk, I talked to someone there about my problem. They said I must have done something wrong. But now after reading this I am thinking the heat was the issue as I originally thought.

Anybody else have this problem? I'm thinking in the future I should use stabond or the 3M structual adhesive to avoid this in the future, opinions? Also found someone using rhino glue (which loose to be similar the gorrilla glue).

[Jim P]

Properly installed drings should not come loose 90-100-110 degrees death freakin valley - they should stay.

no need to reinvent the wheel. Check out Mike Yees instruction page - if you follow those you will not have them pull out.