just wondering.....

[jim gross]

OOOOOO Adam only 3" i am so sorry for your wife. Paul thanks for the angst posting . most cool. .....Jimi i would use bottom line width of 27" pay no attention to that silly little man from new york he only has 3" and an unhappy wife. Adam is a small guy as you know. I also had to ad width forward to correct missing stability in my boat. As you know i came out at first batt woefully under volume and stability. Knee width = if you can plaster em against the side wall area all the better but my knee centers are right around 17.5" seat is exactly 6" length = not as important in 9foot 2.75" Gallons hard to tell with the huge drop in my cockpit rim. Guestimation meter says 37.25. I guess your intrest has been peaked like mine was this past spring HEHEHEHEHE COOL See ya this spring. JIM

[Mike W.]

My heart was really in doing a ground breaking dropper. One thing I wanted to bring to the design is true stability. Would anyone like to contribute input as to
1. a good stable boat width
2. a nice knee width (center of knee to center of knee)
3. a way comfy seat height

Cool

I'm guessing around 27" would be a good width. That's what my Sith is & the indentions on the foam from my knee bones are 18 1/2" apart. That's the widest my knees are in any of my boats. That spread allows me to have my lowest saddle in that boat, 7". Some of my seats are 8" high. 6" is too low for me. Distance from the bottom of the boat to the top of the hip pads is 12". Yeah, I'm old, fat & inflexible Just for reference, I'm 5'7" & 198lbs.

Even though the Sith & Acrobat are the same width, the smaller cockpit openning of the Acrobat only allows 13" of knee spread. That makes the boat less comfortable & I have to have a taller seat. The Sith has a little larger than the "standard slalom" cockpit openning & my Acro has a smaller than "standard" openning.

[Sir Adam]

The other issue with the Acrobat is not necessarily the size of the opening, but it's height off the hull - most of us (myself including) can't get much of our leg / knee under that rim. The Sith's has much more depth, and you can.

The Mentor, on the other hand, assumes you will not be able to get much of your leg under the deck, so it doesn't HAVE deck there....

It is definitely a bit of out-there thinking and design, but when you're clueless and have way to many boats to paddle and look at all the time that's what happens:)

[adkSara]

OOOOOO Adam only 3" i am so sorry for your wife. Paul thanks for the angst posting . most cool. .....Jimi i would use bottom line width of 27" pay no attention to that silly little man from new york he only has 3" and an unhappy wife. Adam is a small guy as you know.

Seriously now... necessary??? Try if you can to keep topics onto boating and if you don't have anything good to contribute just don't.

On topic... a new boat design sounds awesome - I know how hard Adam's been working on first the Maven design and now the Mentor. And helping with the sculpting a bit and the computer design of the Mentor I know how much is going into this boat thinking especially of comfort and stability around the center...

I think the Mentor design is coming out really cool and can't wait to see Adam trying to sink it in the river! I know he's complaining that the water is freezing over up here - but the river out in front of the house is still open and if he works on the seaming this weekend hopefully he can hop into a dry suit & the water and we'll post some pictures.

Keep the cheer
ADKSara
(wife)

[Sir Adam]

I'm staying out of this one!!!

(a note..I know Jim is just joking around here, as I've met him, and I'm choosing just to let it pass. As a rule anything deemed a "personal attack" by the moderators (vs. discussion of a boat or piece of gear) is deemed unaccepted here and deleted...we realize there are other forums where this is common..but we're not one of those forums).

Back on to a much more exciting topic...

Since this (Cquirt designs) does seem to be a hot topic I guess I'll post the unfinished Mentor up. For the record, I'm just sitting on a scrap piece of foam. Because I can spread my legs so wide and rotate them out from my hips, it feels super stable and actually rather comfortable.

I'm trying to show the depth involved here, but until you see the boat in person it's really tough to understand.

The last image is before the interior seams (or even rim) were done...the boat being compared is a relatively low cut master cut acrobat

Hopefully within a week I'll have some in-water pictures.

For the record this is a 'full cut' Mentor...nothing taken out of the seams (and the exterior ones still need to be done...).

Taking an inch, or more, out of the boat is very, very doable.

[Mike W.]

WOW The only thing I like better than red is red metal-flake Adam, that's a GREAT looking boat! Interesting shape of the openning. That should work.

[PAC]

You go adkSara! I too don't think Jim mean harm but... that one was hard to explain to the kid. Note: Jim play nice you were just put on notice by a power higher than any of us Admins!
(I know you will!!!)
Sara please keep Adam on task to get that boat done and available for testing! Oh and make sure you take some good video since you are our link to getting to know this project - as the documentor!

Thanks for putting up with us, him and the addiction!

Adam as for that boat..way frick'n cool! I'm assuming you used the boxed out cockpit / skirt like the Atom / Cascade. Please say its so! Might also need a "Jimmy rim"!
Nice spread on the knees... a far cry from the Mavin! I like everything except those hard edges but you already know my thoughts on that. But I can see what you mean about them not being as hard as I thought they were.
The concave design looks really sweet and deeper than I thought.
What's the seat height? That does look com-fy!
Keep us posted on the seaming and we a wait more pix and video (hint Sarah)!
Paul C.

PS: How is you bike - sounds like Kenneth has a nice little trip in the works.

[Sir Adam]

On the rim...my own design, size-wise my skirts for the Maven and my Viper (which was supposedly sized off the Atom) will fit. I'll know how well next week i hope:)

The rim height and curvature is as per John Mason (Mountain Surf) to fit a fatlip deck (others fit fine too).

A jimirim WOULD be sweet, but that would involve having a specific sized skirt....

The seat I'm sitting on is a 3" piece of foam!!!!

A 6" er is deluxe.

I'll likely go for 4", with other pieces available for folks to demo the boat with that like higher saddles.

[jims]

Thanks everyone! This gives me some hard cold facts to work with. It's amazing the variety of Cquirts out there. I'm still thinkin of something very different....

Don't worry about me keeping you posted with pics and stuff- I won't!! This will be a surprise. HOPEFULLY there will be a unit to play with in time for the Cquirtfest in the spring. And -in my dreams- the Alley will be a perfect level for you guys to disappear in.

One final question- seems people like the adaptability of a "standard" size cockpit rim. Would anyone have an exact measurement of a standard circumference? For instance - my squirt kayaks are about exactly 6'.

This unit will have a Jimirim- for dems dat want the best- but it can easily be rendered into a standard rim for anyone who doesn't want to invest in a new skirt or drydeck. Do they make drydecks for C-1s?

Anyways- this will be fun to play with. I really hope it don't float!

thanks,
jim

[Mike W.]

What's up with guys named Jim not giving progress reports? Y'all just keep us in suspense

I can trace the rim on my Sith & mail it to you. Just pm or e-mail me w/ your address.

[jims]

Thanks!

rt.1 box 30 albright,wv 26519

jim


I'm just glad to be able to come up with something a little different.
NO PEEKING!

[jims]

The Mentor looks fun! You should be able to whip those ends around with impunity. In the pics with a second boat- is that a Max of some sort?

Looking forward to your play report~~
jim

[Sir Adam]

The other boat (blue and green) is a "Master cut" (shorter, lower volume) Acrobat, which is considered by a lot of us to currently be the best production Cquirt here in North America. This particular boat is "low cut" for 185 lbs...so someone of that weight generally has both decks underwater, with just the rim peaking out, in theory anyway.

The problem with the Acrobat (for me anyway) is that you can't really cut it down that much more. NZMatt has one that is cut down more, but even that one is much more of a cruising squirt that is only able to mystery at powerful features....at least at our weights.

That' is what lead me to design first the Maven, then the Mentor...we'll see how it all turns out.

Have fun with it...and if you have any questions, you know where to find us....

[jim gross]

I have been scolded. HAHAHAHAHA Sara Adam is right it was a jest hon. I couldn,t hep that one it just flew out there. Adam i didn,t even realise you were married. Fives to ya there. By the way Adam the boat looks sweet. Wanna seam my next one for me too. ????. And is that thing gonna actualy float with anyone other than you in it.?? Whats the volume???? Jimi i useually just make my rims off a skirt i already have. Most cboaters have an assortment because we whind up paddlein conversions. Your the builder you pick the size .And after i left the puter the other day i was thinkin bout you buildin cboats now. I finaly came up with a new name for mine . THE FORKLIFT PALLET. As it will prolly pale in comparison to your entry into our world. Guys i bet he still sinkd better than us even with 1 blade. JIM

[Mike W.]

Jim, you should have the Sith rim tracing on Wednesday. It's the outside edge of the rim.