Tell me - H3 245 or h3 255 or does it really matter?
Sorry for the lame rhymes and weak beats, here's the meat of the matter:
I'm sort of on the weight line between the 245 and 255. I'm hovering between 185-195#s these days and I'm a leggy 6'-4". I have k1 friends paddling the 245 that weigh more than I do and they love it but I don't know how that would correlate to c1.
Here's my thoughts so far.
Pros
255 - deeper cockpit for my long legs. (It would be nice to have 7 to 8" saddle in here), slightly wider = slightly more stablity
245 - lighter and shorter - easier on shoulders carrying it, small performance enhancement due to weight difference.
Cons -
255 - monster boat + heavy = why not just paddle a big ol' OC?
245 - smaller insides - less room for legs. Cockpit digging thighs.
Also, how much does the outfitting in the H3 weigh? I'm sure once I rip out the plastic seat and bulk head and replace it with a foam saddle, a fence rail, and some racheting snowboard bindings, she'll be shedding a few pounds. In any case I am sure my h3 c1 will be lighter than its k1 counterpart.
I just can't seem to make up my mind!!!!! I have inspected both as k1s and the 255 as a c1 in progress but haven't paddled either as a c boat. Seems fine as far as I can tell as a k1.
Help me.
Dave
H3? Christmas is coming and the boat fund is getting fatter!
Moderators: kenneth, sbroam, TheKrikkitWars, Mike W., Sir Adam, KNeal, PAC, adamin
H3? Christmas is coming and the boat fund is getting fatter!
Flailing offside since 2000!
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abbird
boatin
hey dave,
i hear you. im basically grappling with the same issue myself: stability vs manuverability.
my thought was that maybe it's worth it to paddle a bigger boat if I could just have that slight width advantage for stability. Im not sure though. I am going to go check out both of these hulls tomorrow though and make up my mind. i should be able to tell just by sitting in them and looking at them. it's a shame it's so hard to demo c-1s, but that's part of the fun i think.
let me know how you make out man
later
Alden
i hear you. im basically grappling with the same issue myself: stability vs manuverability.
my thought was that maybe it's worth it to paddle a bigger boat if I could just have that slight width advantage for stability. Im not sure though. I am going to go check out both of these hulls tomorrow though and make up my mind. i should be able to tell just by sitting in them and looking at them. it's a shame it's so hard to demo c-1s, but that's part of the fun i think.
let me know how you make out man
later
Alden
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the great gonzo
- Paddling Benefactor
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- Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 2:03 am
- Location: Montréal, Québec
Here are my thoughts:
-weight: difference is 3.5 lbs, so I don't think it makes a big difference, at least not for a creeker. If it was a playboat, it would probably a different story.
-width: 1/2 inch difference, don't know if this really makes a big difference.
-length: 4 inches probably slightly more speed for the 255, a little more maneuvrabilityfor the 245.
The by far biggest difference, according to the stats, is volume, 67 gallons for the 245 versus 80 gallons for the 255.
So I think the main question is probably more how much volume you prefer.
just my 2 cents.
martin
-weight: difference is 3.5 lbs, so I don't think it makes a big difference, at least not for a creeker. If it was a playboat, it would probably a different story.
-width: 1/2 inch difference, don't know if this really makes a big difference.
-length: 4 inches probably slightly more speed for the 255, a little more maneuvrabilityfor the 245.
The by far biggest difference, according to the stats, is volume, 67 gallons for the 245 versus 80 gallons for the 255.
So I think the main question is probably more how much volume you prefer.
just my 2 cents.
martin
Everyone must believe in something. I believe I'll go canoeing - Henry David Thoreau
Low Volume Creeks
Which is better for low volume creeks? High volume boat or low (lower???) volume boat? Maybe that will answer my question.
Dave
Dave
Flailing offside since 2000!
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aldenb
boats
i visited zoar outdoor today and checked out some boats. i think the H3 255 is way too big for me. I'm 6' and 150lbs. that boat is just too much volume for me.
the 245 looks perfect for me. apparently zoar uses it as their beginner boat, and the beginners love it. so it HAS to be forgiving
anyway, the 245's hull was very similar to the GTX/GT 8.1 hull, which I paddled and like as a c-1.
later
Alden
the 245 looks perfect for me. apparently zoar uses it as their beginner boat, and the beginners love it. so it HAS to be forgiving
anyway, the 245's hull was very similar to the GTX/GT 8.1 hull, which I paddled and like as a c-1.
later
Alden
GT / GTX
AldenB,
The differences I see in the Daggar GT series and the H3 is above the waterline. H3's appear to have more volume - more creekboat like. Where the Gt's are more playboat like (planing hull RPM). Below the water line they are very similar indeed. I'd have to think that the H3s would be less likely to get squirted in holes and would resurface better off drops than the GT's. Does that jive with what you've seen of the two boats? I'd been looking at the GT's as well but didn't think they'd make as good a creeker as the H3.
I agree the 255 is huge. Looks like you could climb in and take a nap in there.
Dave.
The differences I see in the Daggar GT series and the H3 is above the waterline. H3's appear to have more volume - more creekboat like. Where the Gt's are more playboat like (planing hull RPM). Below the water line they are very similar indeed. I'd have to think that the H3s would be less likely to get squirted in holes and would resurface better off drops than the GT's. Does that jive with what you've seen of the two boats? I'd been looking at the GT's as well but didn't think they'd make as good a creeker as the H3.
I agree the 255 is huge. Looks like you could climb in and take a nap in there.
Dave.
Flailing offside since 2000!
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aldenb
boatin
ha! yeah, definitely a good place for a nap! maybe if i was going to run the Tsang Po, but not for creeking!
anyway, that is exactly what i was thinking about the GTs -- i creeked one (NOC has a demo as a C-1) and it had a nice hull, but i did want something with more volume. plus the woman at the store said that the H3s are more forgiving for beginners apparently. the chines on the GT are perhaps a bit harder. but yeah . . . more volume.
the 245 looks like a great boat, and i may see if i cant get my own h3 fund going!
AB
anyway, that is exactly what i was thinking about the GTs -- i creeked one (NOC has a demo as a C-1) and it had a nice hull, but i did want something with more volume. plus the woman at the store said that the H3s are more forgiving for beginners apparently. the chines on the GT are perhaps a bit harder. but yeah . . . more volume.
the 245 looks like a great boat, and i may see if i cant get my own h3 fund going!
AB
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Judd
For low volume creeks, I'd say go with the 245 over the 255. You're going to want maneuverability over hull speed, and I bet that the 245 would punch holes better than the 255 for you. 80 gallons is a ton of volume to punch thru the sticky stuff, especially with only one blade for power.
If you're planning on doing any tripping with it, the extra 13 gallons of storage space would be mighty nice, and the gear weight you'd be carrying would push you up at least another 20 pounds, right into the range of the 255.
Judd
If you're planning on doing any tripping with it, the extra 13 gallons of storage space would be mighty nice, and the gear weight you'd be carrying would push you up at least another 20 pounds, right into the range of the 255.
Judd
My thoughts...
Hey Folks,
Don't know if this response is too late in coming or not but....I'm about 6'3" and a tad heavier at about 225lbs plus gear on top of that....so I went for the H3 255 without even considering the 245. Quite simply: It is an amazing boat. I did A LOT of research before making my choice. Quite honestly it was everything I was looking for. My original goal was an expedition boat, but also something that would work well for bigger drops, steeper runs, or just general river running where there was no use/need for a playboat.
It is fast, stable, easy to roll, comfortable, and very user friendly. It is a TANK of a boat, even at my weight, so ya gotta drive it, ya know? You can't just float along....you gotta be paddling it. It will punch just about anything but you can't run a river like a playboater....NO stern pivots in the H3! You have to be more like an openboater...except you don't take on water! I imagine teh 245 would be similar handling...just a wee bit smaller package.
Hope that helps. If you have any questions or thoughts...drop me a line anytime! I'm happy to help if possible. If you are ever near Ottawa you can always demo mine.
Kalin.
Don't know if this response is too late in coming or not but....I'm about 6'3" and a tad heavier at about 225lbs plus gear on top of that....so I went for the H3 255 without even considering the 245. Quite simply: It is an amazing boat. I did A LOT of research before making my choice. Quite honestly it was everything I was looking for. My original goal was an expedition boat, but also something that would work well for bigger drops, steeper runs, or just general river running where there was no use/need for a playboat.
It is fast, stable, easy to roll, comfortable, and very user friendly. It is a TANK of a boat, even at my weight, so ya gotta drive it, ya know? You can't just float along....you gotta be paddling it. It will punch just about anything but you can't run a river like a playboater....NO stern pivots in the H3! You have to be more like an openboater...except you don't take on water! I imagine teh 245 would be similar handling...just a wee bit smaller package.
Hope that helps. If you have any questions or thoughts...drop me a line anytime! I'm happy to help if possible. If you are ever near Ottawa you can always demo mine.
Kalin.
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chuck naill
- CBoats Addict
- Posts: 483
- Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 10:44 am
- Location: Knoxville, Tennessee
Bernie
I met a very knowledgable dealer from Dayton, Ohio , Whitewater Warehouse, that might answer you questions. He does some custom c 1 conversions and is a c boater himself. Call Bernie Farley @ 937-222-7020. 