Dagger Green Boat as a C1?

Coldwater · Post by **Coldwater** » Mon Mar 22, 2010 1:19 am

I'm wondering if anyone has paddled a Green Boat as a C1? I noticed that a C1er raced one at last year's Green race, but other than that I can't seem to find much information. It is obviously a bit on the narrow side (hull width is listed at 24.25 inches) as far as being a good candidate for a conversion. The "old school" boats that are of similar width tend to be quite tippy, though this design may have a flatter hull which would add initial stability. I am interested in the boat for attainments, big water, and generally just having a fast boat to mess around in. Thanks!

xmas0c1c1k1 · Post by **xmas0c1c1k1** » Mon Mar 22, 2010 1:29 am

do a search on the site you will find some info.
Jay Ditty had one and he gave a first impressions review and a later review.
Sounds like it is alot of work to paddle as a c1.
I think there are plenty good options for what you want that would work better. Cascade for sure will do everything you said. Maybe look into some glass boats

the great gonzo · Post by **the great gonzo** » Mon Mar 22, 2010 2:26 am

have you thought about a slalom boat? If adequately sized for you they are great for everything you are looking for. Great for attaining, good in big water and great to mess around in.

TGG!

Coldwater · Post by **Coldwater** » Mon Mar 22, 2010 6:08 am

Thank you for the responses. I must not be so proficient using the search function on this site. I did try looking for info on the Green Boat. I wouldn't mind a Cascade or a slalom boat to mess around in, though up here it is exceedingly difficult to find boats. There just happened to be a nearly new Green Boat for sale on Craigslist. Are C1 slalom boats typically wider than K1 slalom boats? I guess I'll continue my search for a long boat.

Lennart · Post by **Lennart** » Mon Mar 22, 2010 7:32 am

yes slalom c1 is 5 cm wider then a K1.

and the design is also quite different. If you think about converting. I would not recommed that.
the boat for you :
http://www.robsonpaddle.de/robsonpaddle ... ompetition

to bad that robson's transport to the us is not so good I think.

xmas0c1c1k1 · Post by **xmas0c1c1k1** » Mon Mar 22, 2010 7:49 am

I didn't see that you were in alaska. If the green boat is cheap maybe go for it. It may not be the best cboat but really there isn't much feedback from it as a conversion and I'm sure it would help your skills alot!!!

ezwater · Post by **ezwater** » Mon Mar 22, 2010 10:23 pm

It depends on info I haven't seen with regard to the Green Boat. If it has firm initial stability and is not "roly poly" then it may make a good cruising c-1. But I remember trying a Dagger Animas (a very good old-school kayak) converted for c-1, and it was too lacking in initial stability.

golder · Post by **golder** » Mon Mar 22, 2010 11:02 pm

i was just looking at a green boat as it paddled by me (quickly, no doubt) on the watauga. talked w/ the guy hand paddling it (edgar), who also paddles a bit of oc-1 (a nitro). he thought a c-1 conversion in it would be a bad idea. from looking at it, i've got to agree.

xmas0c1c1k1 · Post by **xmas0c1c1k1** » Tue Mar 23, 2010 3:17 am

You prob found this with the search but here is what Jay said about the green boat. Thought i would move it here for you and anyone else thinking about this boat.

"I guess I should update my comments since that first post last year. I ended up selling the greenboat after a few more runs. It wasn't too tippy (for a narrow kayak conversion), but it did require a great deal of off-side and correction strokes when moving at full speed in class 1-3 water, which is the where most races (except maybe the Green Race) are won and lost. I felt like my old Dagger Response was faster when taking all this into consideration. I might not have given it enough of a chance, and probably could have tried some different saddle placements to see if the directional control would improve. I think it would also be very fast when running steep ledge drops where you want to keep your momentum up just after landing, or skipping over shallow rocky sections like you find on the Green. Bernie still has one and seems to like it. I'd also really like to try one of the LL Hungee's, but they are in very limited supply. My advice would be to try out the Greenboat if you're interested, because you can always put the kayak outfitting back in and sell it if it doesn't work out."
Jay

So, I don't think it is a bad review at all I just don't think it did what he was looking for i.e. races like gauley
I really think that it would be worth a shot if the price is right. I don't think that stability is as big of a deal in this boat as some make it out to be (its got to be more stable than a wildwater boat), and as you described you are going to use this boat for messing around so paddling a hard boat to paddle is great practice I think the downsides that Jay mentions will make this a great training boat, because you can work on balance, paddling up front and strength. I know I learned a whole lot from paddling a session that was way to small for me.
I say go for it and let us know how it is unless you can get something else really cool like a slalom boat.

bcmcmillan · Post by **bcmcmillan** » Tue Mar 23, 2010 4:08 am

I absolutly love the green boat! I am a conversion paddler though(crossfire, freefall (2008 race boat), and a kingpin). All of those boats are pretty narrow so I guess that ive just gotten used to the tippyness. I also have about a three inch saddle in the green boat. It does take a good bit of corrective strokes in flat water although I still paddle it doing attainments about three days a week. That boat was made for the green and i dont like paddleing anything else there now. It has so much speed comming off of drops you basically point where you want to go and you are there. All in all I love my green boat and i would say give it a try and like someone else said "if you dont like it just put the kayak outfitting back in and sell it".
Hope that maybe helps
Brad

Coldwater · Post by **Coldwater** » Wed Mar 24, 2010 3:52 am

Friends, I appreciate the informative replies. I would love to get my hands on an appropriately sized plastic C1 slalom. (I'm about 200lbs.)

It was nice to read some opinions on the Green Boat. I may have to think about it a little more. As I mentioned, it is very difficult to get boats around here, particularly more recently designed used boats.

I would like to think the boat would track relatively well and be fast compared to any other C boat that I've paddled. The boat's a good distance away so I would like to be fairly certain before I make the drive.

markzak · Post by **markzak** » Wed Mar 24, 2010 3:57 pm

I paddle a converted Dagger Gradient at 24.5 inches wide and it is a narrow C1 for sure. I just recommend a lower saddle height and I actually don't mind the tippiness, I think it builds character. Honestly though, I'd prefer a wider platform, like an Everest, but like you ColdWater... I take what I can find used and make it work. I paddle Cl IV, IV+, V, and V+ in my converted Gradient in the Eastern Pennsylvania area including Raymondskill, Shohola, Hornbecks, Bottom Moose, etc.

Sometimes you buy a boat for $300 and instead of bitching about how much it sucks and how much you'd like another boat you spend the $900 you saved over buying a new boat and you go cool places and do cool things. Just my 2 cents, paddling is about being out there, not about always having the right weapon for the right day in any condition.

C-Forum

Dagger Green Boat as a C1?

Dagger Green Boat as a C1?

i'm guessing no

I was the green boat racer in the 2009 green race