Maybe I missed something....
Moderators: kenneth, sbroam, TheKrikkitWars, Mike W., Sir Adam, KNeal, PAC, adamin
-
- CBoats.net Staff
- Posts: 4136
- Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2002 12:00 am
- Location: Adirondacks, NY State, USA
- Contact:
Actually, I see a lot of agreement here:
There are many reasons folks paddle the craft they do
There are many reasons folks got in to the sport (cool boats, styling class III, or running the V+ Gnar)
If we each do what we enjoy, try to share our excitement with others, AND respect those that enjoy different aspects of the sport, our community will grow overall
There are many reasons folks paddle the craft they do
There are many reasons folks got in to the sport (cool boats, styling class III, or running the V+ Gnar)
If we each do what we enjoy, try to share our excitement with others, AND respect those that enjoy different aspects of the sport, our community will grow overall
Keep the C!
Adam
Adam
- Smurfwarrior
- C Maven
- Posts: 1491
- Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:09 am
- Location: Utah
Is whats missing actually a CARROT? Hear me out..
Bunches of buttboaters I know have goals... sponsorship, competition, being video stars... all that stuff.
What do we have? I guess first we should chat about sponsorships and 'professional athletes' and their differences. Pro athletes are athletes first and foremost and that is their job. Paid to paddle... salary... equipment... media promotion by sponsors... Getting free equipment is simply a 'flow sponsorship' and is actually easy to get in a number of sports. Getting that doesn't translate into becoming a 'Pro boater'... just a 'Sponsored boater'.. you get it I think. Kayakers come close to or hit that end goal of 'pro' status but what do we have as the 'end of the rainbow' for inspired canoe paddlers? Whats the Carrot at the end of our string? The Olympics for those slalom types would be the bigtime for them... I'm talking other than that.
Although very very few will ever reach that end goal in Kayaking, its still there as a motivator, just like with baseball, basketball...etc.. there is SOMETHING to shoot for.
Just my opinion.
Bunches of buttboaters I know have goals... sponsorship, competition, being video stars... all that stuff.
What do we have? I guess first we should chat about sponsorships and 'professional athletes' and their differences. Pro athletes are athletes first and foremost and that is their job. Paid to paddle... salary... equipment... media promotion by sponsors... Getting free equipment is simply a 'flow sponsorship' and is actually easy to get in a number of sports. Getting that doesn't translate into becoming a 'Pro boater'... just a 'Sponsored boater'.. you get it I think. Kayakers come close to or hit that end goal of 'pro' status but what do we have as the 'end of the rainbow' for inspired canoe paddlers? Whats the Carrot at the end of our string? The Olympics for those slalom types would be the bigtime for them... I'm talking other than that.
Although very very few will ever reach that end goal in Kayaking, its still there as a motivator, just like with baseball, basketball...etc.. there is SOMETHING to shoot for.
Just my opinion.
- Craig Smerda
- L'Edge Designer
- Posts: 2815
- Joined: Tue Dec 10, 2002 3:59 am
- Location: WaUSAu Wisconsin USA North America Earth, etc.
- Smurfwarrior
- C Maven
- Posts: 1491
- Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:09 am
- Location: Utah
-
- CBoats.net Staff
- Posts: 4136
- Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2002 12:00 am
- Location: Adirondacks, NY State, USA
- Contact:
Skiing hasn't always been that way, and I suspect won't be that way again. Rodeo (whitewater) briefly appeared to be a pale shadow of that.
I don't think the $ are there - if they were we'd see more boats given away for raffles, as well as "sponsorships".
We'd all have to purchase more new boats for that to happen (and new boats and new (high quality) skis are about the same price).
I think the real difference is the skiing "scene" vs the boating "scene"... I know far more folks who "ski" and rarely take a run, yet purchase the latest gear (and talk the talk) vs. boaters who own NEW gear and don't use it.
I don't think the $ are there - if they were we'd see more boats given away for raffles, as well as "sponsorships".
We'd all have to purchase more new boats for that to happen (and new boats and new (high quality) skis are about the same price).
I think the real difference is the skiing "scene" vs the boating "scene"... I know far more folks who "ski" and rarely take a run, yet purchase the latest gear (and talk the talk) vs. boaters who own NEW gear and don't use it.
Keep the C!
Adam
Adam
- FullGnarlzOC
- C Maven
- Posts: 1329
- Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 2:31 am
- Location: York, PA
Smurf is on the right track.... I think that would come with time... as the sport grows. Sure it would be nice to have those kind of 'incentives' now... but it ain't the case.
Craig is right - it's about paddling for enjoyment... but there are some things that we can do to get some more reasons in there...
Glory being one of them... you can be one of 200 plus kayakers int he green race...or you can get the satisfaction of being on of a handful of canoers in the world that runs it... Just gotta relate that to the people
Craig is right - it's about paddling for enjoyment... but there are some things that we can do to get some more reasons in there...
Glory being one of them... you can be one of 200 plus kayakers int he green race...or you can get the satisfaction of being on of a handful of canoers in the world that runs it... Just gotta relate that to the people
http://www.gnarlzoutdoors.com
Silverbirch Canoes - North American Distributor
Email: tom@gnarlzoutdoors.com
Silverbirch Canoes - North American Distributor
Email: tom@gnarlzoutdoors.com
andYeah, but we are not talking about ourselves here.. we're a bit nuts, we're talking about drawing that fired up younger crowd that seems to manage to find the money and rides to the ski slopes to snowboard. They dream of growing up to be a pro like Shaun White, a PRO.
I work with kids on a ski team (Freestyle - mogls, air and rails) and they are not about "the pro"s. They could care less.. as is the case with 99% of the park rats....purchase the latest gear (and talk the talk) vs. boaters who own NEW gear and don't use it.
They care about the moves.... and if their feet are in the boots. They care 'bout the gear (same here ..right??)!
Its about the fun, the freedom, the ride. Granted they are not boarders (Freestyle skiers are a bit more "X"treme IMHO) but the boarders I know are pretty much on the same wave lenght.
Its about peeps and the rush! Cboating should be the same!
Have a BSA meeting to night for the boys to plan what they want to do and will try to get WW in that planning...
Its the adults that will be the road block! Same olde - over and over again... WW is dangerous because its out of their personal comfort zone (skiing is in that zone ....even if only on green groomers ... so its okay)!
Lets shift that thought process!!!
Paul C.
Cboats Moderator
Official TOG Member (Team Old Guy)!
Cboats Moderator
Official TOG Member (Team Old Guy)!
- FullGnarlzOC
- C Maven
- Posts: 1329
- Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 2:31 am
- Location: York, PA
the feeling of great accomplishment, mixed with the social aspect... what else can you want!?!
a sport that involves fineese, power, confidence under pressure, fight-or-flight survival skills, team work....all while using 'forces of nature' to do what you wanto do...
a way to 'reach' for something mor...except in whitewater canoeing... u can reach for it alll. a place where job requirements, economic conditions, ect. have no effect.
It's just you, the water...and glory. And it doesn't matter how hard your pushing it...if you are...and you succeed in your goals...ur gonna be stoked.
a sport that involves fineese, power, confidence under pressure, fight-or-flight survival skills, team work....all while using 'forces of nature' to do what you wanto do...
a way to 'reach' for something mor...except in whitewater canoeing... u can reach for it alll. a place where job requirements, economic conditions, ect. have no effect.
It's just you, the water...and glory. And it doesn't matter how hard your pushing it...if you are...and you succeed in your goals...ur gonna be stoked.
http://www.gnarlzoutdoors.com
Silverbirch Canoes - North American Distributor
Email: tom@gnarlzoutdoors.com
Silverbirch Canoes - North American Distributor
Email: tom@gnarlzoutdoors.com
Kaz made a good point a few pages back when he mentioned drinking Keystone Light -- it's a cheap . . . err, "affordable" beverage for tightwa. . . err, "budget conscious" individuals . . .
Actually, let me start again. What I meant to say, was . . .
Kaz made a good point a few pages back when he mentioned the difficulty in retaining younger boaters in our sport, especially those who migrate toward other pursuits beyond the age of 16 or 17. As a teacher myself, I can certainly appreciate the myriad of choices facing teenagers, and their difficulty in sticking with what is a somewhat cost- and travel-intensive hobby.
That said, I have certainly not been seeming to lack paddling partners . . .
What I mean to say is -- in light of what Kaz said, I think that college programs might be a good way to both introduce and retain young people in the sport.
I have always marveled at the kayaking program at Dartmouth College, for one. Of course, their program has the backing of money, tradition . . . and a fleet of boats that would put Woody and Shane's warehouse to shame. But it seems like it turns out, year after year, countless young people who have become enamored of boating at just that critical age. I'm not sure how many of them stay with it, but it's getting kids boating who would otherwise be . . . I dunno, preparing for a lucrative, well-rounded life or something silly.
I taught kayaking briefly in college. There was definitely tons of interest. I think I was too busy running class V to take as much care of the program -- or even half as much -- as it required . . . but the interest was definitely there.
What I mean to say is that I think college kayaking programs would be a great "in."
And of course, you could always try to orient a program toward open boats or closed canoes if that were your idea.
Anyway . . . what's the sign-off we say around here (it's been a while) . . . ? "Half the paddle, half the brain"?
Alden
Actually, let me start again. What I meant to say, was . . .
Kaz made a good point a few pages back when he mentioned the difficulty in retaining younger boaters in our sport, especially those who migrate toward other pursuits beyond the age of 16 or 17. As a teacher myself, I can certainly appreciate the myriad of choices facing teenagers, and their difficulty in sticking with what is a somewhat cost- and travel-intensive hobby.
That said, I have certainly not been seeming to lack paddling partners . . .
What I mean to say is -- in light of what Kaz said, I think that college programs might be a good way to both introduce and retain young people in the sport.
I have always marveled at the kayaking program at Dartmouth College, for one. Of course, their program has the backing of money, tradition . . . and a fleet of boats that would put Woody and Shane's warehouse to shame. But it seems like it turns out, year after year, countless young people who have become enamored of boating at just that critical age. I'm not sure how many of them stay with it, but it's getting kids boating who would otherwise be . . . I dunno, preparing for a lucrative, well-rounded life or something silly.
I taught kayaking briefly in college. There was definitely tons of interest. I think I was too busy running class V to take as much care of the program -- or even half as much -- as it required . . . but the interest was definitely there.
What I mean to say is that I think college kayaking programs would be a great "in."
And of course, you could always try to orient a program toward open boats or closed canoes if that were your idea.
Anyway . . . what's the sign-off we say around here (it's been a while) . . . ? "Half the paddle, half the brain"?
Alden
Well, each and every one of you could try something along the lines of what I am doing....
The idea is simple...let people try as many canoes as possible of all different types and sizes at no cost in a fun and safe way...!!
Hopefully at least some will come away with the seeds of a new passion....This is what I have set up and posted on a number of UK forums...
OC, Dee!! 13th Feb 2011¡K
Awesome free canoe funday come along and enjoy, who knows you may even fall in love with canoeing
If you have never thought about trying a canoe come on down, it doesnt have to be your thing! There will be a full range of boats you can try absolutely free!!
Boats will include,
Traditional open canoes of various types.
Whitewater Canoes, Including the awesome new Esquife L'edge.
Open Playboats.
Freestyle canoes.
So if your a seasoned vet, kayaker or have never even tried a canoe before come to Mile end Mill on the 13th Feb from 10 am and have a great day...Its fun!.
Try canoeing in a variety of different boats.
You never know you might actually like it..!
The day will feature,
Novice fun and taster sessions, there will be some great little competitions including a mini slalom, poling, & Freestyle events with prizes!!
Demonstrations will include
Basic Canoe technique, canoe manoeuvres, Poling, Equipment, Rolling etc...
If you are already a canoeist bring your own boat along and join in the fun.
There will be no formal coaching or training sessions running on the day other than that required to ensure novice safety and enjoyment.
The ethos of this event is to turn up have fun, and enjoy canoeing!!
The event will go ahead providing the water level is less than 8 on the MEM Gauge. If it has to be postponed it will be held 2 weeks later on the 28th Feb.
Paddlers will have to pay normal water fees but all activities, boat sessions and competitions are free so turn up and enjoy!
The Event will be supported by
Whitewater active,
Paddleworks,
Nomad Canoes,
Pro Adventure Llangollen
Chris
The idea is simple...let people try as many canoes as possible of all different types and sizes at no cost in a fun and safe way...!!
Hopefully at least some will come away with the seeds of a new passion....This is what I have set up and posted on a number of UK forums...
OC, Dee!! 13th Feb 2011¡K
Awesome free canoe funday come along and enjoy, who knows you may even fall in love with canoeing
If you have never thought about trying a canoe come on down, it doesnt have to be your thing! There will be a full range of boats you can try absolutely free!!
Boats will include,
Traditional open canoes of various types.
Whitewater Canoes, Including the awesome new Esquife L'edge.
Open Playboats.
Freestyle canoes.
So if your a seasoned vet, kayaker or have never even tried a canoe before come to Mile end Mill on the 13th Feb from 10 am and have a great day...Its fun!.
Try canoeing in a variety of different boats.
You never know you might actually like it..!
The day will feature,
Novice fun and taster sessions, there will be some great little competitions including a mini slalom, poling, & Freestyle events with prizes!!
Demonstrations will include
Basic Canoe technique, canoe manoeuvres, Poling, Equipment, Rolling etc...
If you are already a canoeist bring your own boat along and join in the fun.
There will be no formal coaching or training sessions running on the day other than that required to ensure novice safety and enjoyment.
The ethos of this event is to turn up have fun, and enjoy canoeing!!
The event will go ahead providing the water level is less than 8 on the MEM Gauge. If it has to be postponed it will be held 2 weeks later on the 28th Feb.
Paddlers will have to pay normal water fees but all activities, boat sessions and competitions are free so turn up and enjoy!
The Event will be supported by
Whitewater active,
Paddleworks,
Nomad Canoes,
Pro Adventure Llangollen
Chris
-
- Pain Boater
- Posts: 52
- Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2007 11:26 pm
- Location: arkansas
- TheKrikkitWars
- CBoats.net Staff
- Posts: 1440
- Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2008 11:27 am
- Location: Sheffield, South Yorkshire
- Contact:
There'll be tears, and they won't be mine!Mr.DeadLegs wrote:put up better prizes for OC in any race that is out there. Kayakers will take up open boats if nothing else just for the race if there is proper incentive.
Joshua Kelly - "More George Smiley than James Bond"
CBoats Moderator - Not necessarily representing the CBoats staff though...(I'll use words like "moderator", "We" and "CBoats" to make it clear when I am)
CBoats Moderator - Not necessarily representing the CBoats staff though...(I'll use words like "moderator", "We" and "CBoats" to make it clear when I am)
- Smurfwarrior
- C Maven
- Posts: 1491
- Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:09 am
- Location: Utah
I think canoe manufacturers need to step up to the plate like SUP board makers did and PUSH things into high gear this season. They took a risk and look where they are now. Tons of SUPs at the OR show this year. I don't hear SUP makers waiting for their customer base to grow BEFORE acting. Hats off to Blackfly and Esquif for the new boats. Granted, its not a direct translation, but they are selling/marketing SUPs to kayakers who are looking for a challenge/change. That should be our line... A nationwide marketing campaign push would work wonders to increase our numbers combined with an entry level canoe setup to get them in the door....
- FullGnarlzOC
- C Maven
- Posts: 1329
- Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 2:31 am
- Location: York, PA
that's the idea. A general push by everyone should make a world of difference.
http://www.gnarlzoutdoors.com
Silverbirch Canoes - North American Distributor
Email: tom@gnarlzoutdoors.com
Silverbirch Canoes - North American Distributor
Email: tom@gnarlzoutdoors.com